Fluke Solve treatment Query

[fishkeeperscotland]

I'm about to treat my display tank with fluke solve which is the UK equivalent of prazipro.
I wondered if anyone knew
1. How long to stop the skimmer for, the whole 6 weeks of treatment? Is this likely to cause other issues in the tank?
2. Will running ozone affect the treatment amd need to be stopped?
3. Will uv need to be stopped?
Then instructions seemed a bit vague over some of these points.
Thanks!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I'm about to treat my display tank with fluke solve which is the UK equivalent of prazipro.
I wondered if anyone knew
1. How long to stop the skimmer for, the whole 6 weeks of treatment? Is this likely to cause other issues in the tank?
2. Will running ozone affect the treatment amd need to be stopped?
3. Will uv need to be stopped?
Then instructions seemed a bit vague over some of these points.
Thanks!

You should still run the skimmer for aeration, but don't collect any skimmate for 72 hours after each treatment. You may also need to add extra aeration in addition to the bubbles the skimmer produces.

Stop ozone and UV for 72 hours after each dose.

Basically, bacteria breaks down the praziquantel within 72 hours.

How many doses do they tell you to use in their 6 week treatment?

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Thanks for the information, I've a spare skimmer I use solely for ozone so I can aerate with 2 skimmers which should be enough? I was planning on reducing the pump so the skimmer won't collect any skimmate rather than removing the cup.
The fluke solve instructions say treat 1st dose which should be active for 3 weeks, then treat again at 3 weeks so 6 weeks of active treatment. Any water changes need to be topped up with treatment also.
After 72 hours will the skimmer and uv not breakdown the treatment still? Do you not think it would be active for the full 3 weeks after a single dose?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for the information, I've a spare skimmer I use solely for ozone so I can aerate with 2 skimmers which should be enough? I was planning on reducing the pump so the skimmer won't collect any skimmate rather than removing the cup.
The fluke solve instructions say treat 1st dose which should be active for 3 weeks, then treat again at 3 weeks so 6 weeks of active treatment. Any water changes need to be topped up with treatment also.
After 72 hours will the skimmer and uv not breakdown the treatment still? Do you not think it would be active for the full 3 weeks after a single dose?

Yeah - that's not correct, three weeks is too long of an interval. Getting that right is a bit of a guess, but I use 8 days. The idea is that this medication does not kill fluke eggs, it just causes adult flukes to spasm and drop off the fish, then they cannot reattach. If you dose once, new eggs will hatch, and reinfect the fish. If you dose 3 weeks apart, the eggs hatch, attach to the fish and lay new eggs, so you can't stop the infection that way. Dosing three times, 8 days apart (some people say 5 days, others say 9) usually works in having new flukes drop off the fish before they get a chance to lay eggs of their own. I have seen people need to dose 5 times though. It gets complicated: with each dose you make, specialized bacteria grow that eat prazi as a carbon source. Therefore, each dose you make gets digested faster and faster. Eventually, prazi stops working.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Ah ok, I've heard others say the same. I'll try 8 days and do a large water change before each successive dose. Do you know if there's a risk to Dosing too much?
How would you know if 3 doses is enough? I'm happy to do 5. Even if the fish symptoms have resolved there could be eggs around.
I don't mind doing more doses but don't like having to stop the uv and skimmer etc.
Cheers

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Ah ok, I've heard others say the same. I'll try 8 days and do a large water change before each successive dose. Do you know if there's a risk to Dosing too much?
How would you know if 3 doses is enough? I'm happy to do 5. Even if the fish symptoms have resolved there could be eggs around.
I don't mind doing more doses but don't like having to stop the uv and skimmer etc.
Cheers

If you wait at least 5 days between treatments and do a 25% water change prior to each subsequent treatment, you really can’t overdose this.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Hi there, I treated the first dose of fluke solve 24 hours ago. The water has got quite cloudy and today the fish seem very lethargic, most of my lyre tails are sitting on the bottom. Will the cloudy water and lethargy pass soon or is it like this during the whole course of treatment? I hope not as the DT looks terrible now!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi there, I treated the first dose of fluke solve 24 hours ago. The water has got quite cloudy and today the fish seem very lethargic, most of my lyre tails are sitting on the bottom. Will the cloudy water and lethargy pass soon or is it like this during the whole course of treatment? I hope not as the DT looks terrible now!

That shouldn't have done that. Are the fish breathing fast? Do you have good aeration?

You'll need to do a water change to correct that - prazi works in the first 24 hours, so no worry about removing the medication at this point.

Prazi doesn't cause this, it must be the solvents and excipients that they use, they are different than prazipro.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

That shouldn't have done that. Are the fish breathing fast? Do you have good aeration?

You'll need to do a water change to correct that - prazi works in the first 24 hours, so no worry about removing the medication at this point.

Prazi doesn't cause this, it must be the solvents and excipients that they use, they are different than prazipro.

Thanks for the info. Yes all fish breathing faster than usual but this is normal with the reduced o2? Anthias worse maybe because of their high metabolsim? I've got 2 skimmers overflowing so should be OK, there's some microbubbles in the display which I thought may be stressing them out.
I'll do a 30% water change, you'd recommend not adding more treatment with this, hold off until second dose on day 5?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for the info. Yes all fish breathing faster than usual but this is normal with the reduced o2? Anthias worse maybe because of their high metabolsim? I've got 2 skimmers overflowing so should be OK, there's some microbubbles in the display which I thought may be stressing them out.
I'll do a 30% water change, you'd recommend not adding more treatment with this, hold off until second dose on day 5?

A 30% change may not be sufficient. 50% at least is what I'd aim for. I would wait 8 days after the first treatment before redosing.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

OK, if I don't top up the treatment is there not a risk that eggs in the water may hatch and latch to the fish again?
Can I start the skimmer again or hold off the full 72hrs, dose the skimmer affect the treatment level?
Thanks

 

[Jay Hemdal]

OK, if I don't top up the treatment is there not a risk that eggs in the water may hatch and latch to the fish again?
Can I start the skimmer again or hold off the full 72hrs, dose the skimmer affect the treatment level?
Thanks

The timing on redose is a bit of a guess - I find an 8 day interval works well, but I've heard everything from five to 10 days. You can start collecting skimmate 24 hours after any given treatment.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Ok, I'll follow your advice and see what happens thanks. Most the fish are flashing but not excessively. Water change will be in the morning once 500 litres of water has heated up sufficiently!

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

The timing on redose is a bit of a guess - I find an 8 day interval works well, but I've heard everything from five to 10 days. You can start collecting skimmate 24 hours after any given treatment.

I forgot to mention I've been Dosing with nopox during the treatment, is this OK or shall I stop it?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I forgot to mention I've been Dosing with nopox during the treatment, is this OK or shall I stop it?

Stop the Nopox! It is consumed by bacteria just like prazi is, and the effects are combined, with potentially lethal results if the oxygen drops too low.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Stop the Nopox! It is consumed by bacteria just like prazi is, and the effects are combined, with potentially lethal results if the oxygen drops too low.

Ah right! Would nopox reduce or speed up the breakdown of the prazi do you know?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Ah right! Would nopox reduce or speed up the breakdown of the prazi do you know?

I'm not sure it changes the speed at which prazi is broken down, but the same bacterial action that Nopox uses takes oxygen out of the water and clouds the water with bacteria, is the same as with praziquantel, so the effect is combined. I presume these are all heterotrophic bacteria that are utilizing a carbon source, so it anything, previous additions of Nopox would intensify the effect.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

I'm not sure it changes the speed at which prazi is broken down, but the same bacterial action that Nopox uses takes oxygen out of the water and clouds the water with bacteria, is the same as with praziquantel, so the effect is combined. I presume these are all heterotrophic bacteria that are utilizing a carbon source, so it anything, previous additions of Nopox would intensify the effect.

Interesting, I've done the water change and everyone is happy again. Will dose again in 5 days or so.
Does the uv break the prazi down? I've started it up again along with skimmer but will turn off after the next dose. Don't think the fish like the skimmer off lol

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Interesting, I've done the water change and everyone is happy again. Will dose again in 5 days or so.
Does the uv break the prazi down? I've started it up again along with skimmer but will turn off after the next dose. Don't think the fish like the skimmer off lol

The presumption is that UV can break down prazi before it can work well, so I always tell folks to turn it off. You should run the skimmer (for aeration) just don't collect the skimmate, as that will remove the prazi. The interval for prazi should be 8 days.

 

[fishkeeperscotland]

Hi there
I've now completed 3 courses of the fluke solve. There are still a few fish doing regular flashing, would you expect this to settle within days?
Also I noticed today my Regal and gem tang now have a very mild cloudiness to the eyes, it's seems quite superficial, could this be a bacterial infection or maybe a result of the fluke treatment?
I was thinking of doing another couple of rounds of fluke solve treatment.
Thanks