ATI Essentials+ and ionic balance

meermann

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 2, 2020
Messages
140
Reaction score
20
Location
Germany
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hi guys and @ATI North America,
since last March I've been using ATI Essentials+ as Calcium supplement. It works good so far, and I'm very satisfied how does it affect coral growth and PH in my tank.
However, I thought it keeps ionic balance (and one of main goals was to avoid water changes). There are few examples of good SPS tanks development during around a year without water changes (using ATI Essentials). So I decided to decrease weekly maintenance of my system and enjoy thriving growth and coloration. So since July I did only a few 10% changes, 2 or 3, using TM Pro Reef salt. Nothing could be wrong :expressionless-face:

Meanwhile I was keeping doing ICP tests and the results disappointed me a bit :oops:

July
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.56.38.png

August
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.57.15.png

September
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.58.30.png

October
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.00.png

January
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.29.png

February
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.59.png


I recalculated the Sulphur values using value for Sodium = 11700ppm, because salinity can differ.
And the results are

July: 896
August: 819
September: 787
October: 839
January: 764
February: 755

I suppose the ideal value for Sulphur would be 900ppm, if Sodium concentration is 11700ppm. However mine is 15% lower.

Any idea why it could happened?
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

Reef Chemist
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
72,100
Reaction score
69,741
Location
Massachusetts, United States
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hi guys and @ATI North America,
since last March I've been using ATI Essentials+ as Calcium supplement. It works good so far, and I'm very satisfied how does it affect coral growth and PH in my tank.
However, I thought it keeps ionic balance (and one of main goals was to avoid water changes). There are few examples of good SPS tanks development during around a year without water changes (using ATI Essentials). So I decided to decrease weekly maintenance of my system and enjoy thriving growth and coloration. So since July I did only a few 10% changes, 2 or 3, using TM Pro Reef salt. Nothing could be wrong :expressionless-face:

Meanwhile I was keeping doing ICP tests and the results disappointed me a bit :oops:

July
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.56.38.png

August
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.57.15.png

September
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.58.30.png

October
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.00.png

January
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.29.png

February
Screenshot 2024-03-07 at 21.59.59.png


I recalculated the Sulphur values using value for Sodium = 11700ppm, because salinity can differ.
And the results are

July: 896
August: 819
September: 787
October: 839
January: 764
February: 755

I suppose the ideal value for Sulphur would be 900ppm, if Sodium concentration is 11700ppm. However mine is 15% lower.

Any idea why it could happened?
Can you post the chloride to sulfate ratio over time? That’s the best gauge of the ionic balance issue.
 
OP
OP
M

meermann

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 2, 2020
Messages
140
Reaction score
20
Location
Germany
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I use a simple Fauna Marin ICP test and it doesn't check Chloride. Because of this I used Sodium as a reference.
My tank is ~50G and I dose up to 50ml/day of ATI Essentials+, I believe daily dosing contains 10g of dry Sodium Bicarbonate, or 2kg of pure Sodium Bicarbonate was added since July.
So maybe Sulphur is OK in my tank and I could have elevated Sodium level? :thinking-face:
Then I have to perform more detailed ICP test
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

Reef Chemist
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
72,100
Reaction score
69,741
Location
Massachusetts, United States
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
The issue with sodium is that it plays off against calcium, magnesium, and potassium. Many folks elevate those above natural levels, so at fixed salinity, it would be low.

Can you post the last whole icp?
 
OP
OP
M

meermann

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 2, 2020
Messages
140
Reaction score
20
Location
Germany
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
The issue with sodium is that it plays off against calcium, magnesium, and potassium. Many folks elevate those above natural levels, so at fixed salinity, it would be low.

Can you post the last whole icp?
I just realized, Ca and Mg levels probably too low in my tank (considering fixed salinity at 10700ppm of Na)? K level looks a bit elevated.
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

Reef Chemist
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
72,100
Reaction score
69,741
Location
Massachusetts, United States
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I think most things are fine, but boosting calcium is a fine plan. I think there’s a slight chloride to sulfate imbalance to excess chloride, but that’s not likely a big deal. It’s either from the salt mix or from calcium chloride dosing.
 
OP
OP
M

meermann

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 2, 2020
Messages
140
Reaction score
20
Location
Germany
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I think most things are fine, but boosting calcium is a fine plan. I think there’s a slight chloride to sulfate imbalance to excess chloride, but that’s not likely a big deal. It’s either from the salt mix or from calcium chloride dosing.
But in terms of increasing sulfate balance, what's the most appropriate salt for this? Perhaps MgSO4 or should I first add Na2SO4 and then a bit of CaCl2, MgCl2 and lower salinity a bit?
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

Reef Chemist
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
72,100
Reaction score
69,741
Location
Massachusetts, United States
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
But in terms of increasing sulfate balance, what's the most appropriate salt for this? Perhaps MgSO4 or should I first add Na2SO4 and then a bit of CaCl2, MgCl2 and lower salinity a bit?

How are you supplementing calcium and alkalinity?
 
OP
OP
M

meermann

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 2, 2020
Messages
140
Reaction score
20
Location
Germany
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
How are you supplementing calcium and alkalinity?
Right now I use TM All For Reef, around a month. But before I used ATI Essentials+ and I was satisfied with the product... except ionic balance. Perhaps I'll switch to ATI Essentials+ again in a week. ATI Essentials+ is completely inorganic, I like how it affects on PH.
 

Randy Holmes-Farley

Reef Chemist
View Badges
Joined
Sep 5, 2014
Messages
72,100
Reaction score
69,741
Location
Massachusetts, United States
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Right now I use TM All For Reef, around a month. But before I used ATI Essentials+ and I was satisfied with the product... except ionic balance. Perhaps I'll switch to ATI Essentials+ again in a week. ATI Essentials+ is completely inorganic, I like how it affects on PH.

I would not do anything about the balance unless you need to supplement magnesium, in which case I’d use Epsom salt.
 

HAVE YOU EVER KEPT A RARE/UNCOMMON FISH, CORAL, OR INVERT? SHOW IT OFF IN THE THREAD!

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%
Back
Top