All Green Algaes dying

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

I have kept a pretty hands off approach to any nuisance algaes, as I personally like the look of the turfs and GHA and other green plant like things, and for pod food. Aside from early dinos, I have not manually removed anything until recently

All of my green algaes, including sea lettuce and chaeto, are melting away this last few weeks. The gha loosens from the rocks and comes off like unrilling a carpet if I tug a corner of it. I did not think haird algaes would come off in a 2inch thick matt like this. My chaeto was about the size of a basketball and is now a softball. These large gorgeous sea lettuce that appeared out if no where months ago that was absolutely thriving, which I would pluck large saycer size leaves of it and move to my sump, have stopped growing and is also now starting to melt.

I dose chaeto grow daily, i have available NO3 and Phos, I dose aminos daily, (brightwell aminos, and polyp booster) the chaeto has done great since its introduction prior to adding fish in October, until May. I have a red macro algae hitchhiker that is thriving and is showing no sign of slowing down.

Changes this last 3 months, lots of new kenya trees from babies that are growing super fast, stopped dosing O2 via oxydator, reduced kalkwasser concentration in ato water from 100 to 50%, stopped dosing phos and NO3, reduced silica dosing by 70%.

Life in tank:
Macro algae in picture
Small amounts of maroon and pink coraline
Chaeto
Sea lettuce
2 different GHA,s
Pink and red cyano deep in sandbed up against glass on the one section my engineer goby does not throw around.
A turf algae of some sort
A thing thay looks like briopsis on a turbosnail.
Film algae some of which my flipper cant scrape and I have to go in with a razor blade


Lots of feather dusters on 2 rocks
Some astrea starfish
Some limpets
Lot of amphipods and isopods
Copepods
Loads of spirobids
Some vermetids
1 blueleg hermit
1 small reef hermit

1 mandarin
2 clowns
1 engineer
4 blue chromis
1 firefish
1 cleaner shrimp
3 nassarius snails that lay thousands of eggs every day
8 astrea snails
1 turbo that is nearing tennisball size
2 trochus
3 ceriths
1 9 headed duncan with amazing polyp extension
1 4 headed frogspawn
1 candycane with 10 heads

Skimmer on constantly with CO2 scrubber recirculating
Empty oxydator
Carbon reactor that has month old rox car on in it
Ocasional felt filter sock
Powerhead in refugium for flow
Blue aquamesh to keep chaeto in fuge

I dose balling part c, sodaash and calc, keep values incredibly stable, on the high side due to low ph, 10.3 dkh and 410 calc, mag 1380.

Any thoughts?

 

[Cole.mormon]

Maybe macro and micro nutrient levels?
Anyone else have any thoughts

 

[Cole.mormon]

Bump

 

[Wasabiroot]

There's a lot going on that makes it hard to pinpoint. It's possible you have an iron deficiency, or your nutrients are too low to sustain a large green hair algae bloom. You also have quite a few different animals all competing for nitrogen and phosphorus. While algae are mega efficient at eking out nutrients, maybe your combined algae bioload bottomed out your nutrients at one point, causing some die off that then caused them to go up a bit again. I don't normally like to proscribe issues with micronutrients since if you're not testing them it's hard to know how the values have changed, but I do know GHA and Chaeto both enjoy iron supplementation. You could try adding Chaetogrow or some kind of supplement and see what happens. It's also possible that the algaes caused some dieoff to itself from becoming too thick.

Another possibility is the reduced Kalk perhaps caused some pH fluctuations that changed the amount of dissolved CO2 available, but that is me speculating and I could be incorrect.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Did I miss where you listed your nitrate and phosphate levels?

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

I did not, but was steady at .04 and 12, has recently creeoed up to 1.2 and something above 12 but not whatever the next step is on the nyos test kit. Phos is with hannah ulr

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

There's a lot going on that makes it hard to pinpoint. It's possible you have an iron deficiency, or your nutrients are too low to sustain a large green hair algae bloom. You also have quite a few different animals all competing for nitrogen and phosphorus. While algae are mega efficient at eking out nutrients, maybe your combined algae bioload bottomed out your nutrients at one point, causing some die off that then caused them to go up a bit again. I don't normally like to proscribe issues with micronutrients since if you're not testing them it's hard to know how the values have changed, but I do know GHA and Chaeto both enjoy iron supplementation. You could try adding Chaetogrow or some kind of supplement and see what happens. It's also possible that the algaes caused some dieoff to itself from becoming too thick.

Another possibility is the reduced Kalk perhaps caused some pH fluctuations that changed the amount of dissolved CO2 available, but that is me speculating and I could be incorrect.

I am starting ti lean towards, my minimal daily chaeto grow could not compete with the absurd amount of algaes I had going on. Sonce I only do 4.5ml chatogrow in 87 total volume per day, I am going to up it.

I do have 15 ml of trac A and K added to my 1500ml reserviors of alk and calc dosers. But Dosing 30ml of each per day, that might not be enough. When the gha started coming loose on its own, it was multiples of pounds of algae. Granted there is water weight to that, it still shocked me as to how heavy it was. As I removed the gha I would shake the pods off it in the tank, dunk it a couple times, and let the water drip out before tossing it in a bucket.

This may be a very substantial amount of trace element depletion that I had not considered, keeping in mind I let it take over entire surfaces and its only a 75g display.

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

I have increased chaetogrow dosing, and it seems to have stopped disappearing.

Could absolutely be coincidence, but will be continuing.

One thing to note, the color has not changed of the macro algaes through this melt, only the GHAs. The turf algaes are still very saturated with color.

 

[Wasabiroot]

Nice. Hopefully micros/macros are the contributing factor. I kind of threw some stuff at the wall to see what would stick. I had a refugium with gracilaria/chaeto (I'm an idiot and cooked it when I left my return pump off - had to drain and clean the sump) but Chaetogrow/chelated iron like Red Sea/Julian's iron/manganese concentrate seemed to improve growth. Salinity, temperature and lighting all influence macro growth in large ways. For example, gracilaria actually does best closer to 1.018 Salinity (IIRC) and at slightly cooler temps.

Good luck with the tank! I'm hoping it improves. I think Chaetogrow mentions daily dosing has better effects, so as long as you don't exceed their recommended dose, you should be OK. I tend to avoid Brightwell products as I feel they don't do a good enough job of explaining their contents and at what concentration, but in the case of Chaetogrow it seems to have a large user base with positive experiences. Too much iron could cause an algal explosion though so keep up on water changes.

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

Nice. Hopefully micros/macros are the contributing factor. I kind of threw some stuff at the wall to see what would stick. I had a refugium with gracilaria/chaeto (I'm an idiot and cooked it when I left my return pump off - had to drain and clean the sump) but Chaetogrow/chelated iron like Red Sea/Julian's iron/manganese concentrate seemed to improve growth. Salinity, temperature and lighting all influence macro growth in large ways. For example, gracilaria actually does best closer to 1.018 Salinity (IIRC) and at slightly cooler temps.

Good luck with the tank! I'm hoping it improves. I think Chaetogrow mentions daily dosing has better effects, so as long as you don't exceed their recommended dose, you should be OK. I tend to avoid Brightwell products as I feel they don't do a good enough job of explaining their contents and at what concentration, but in the case of Chaetogrow it seems to have a large user base with positive experiences. Too much iron could cause an algal explosion though so keep up on water changes.

I will agree with you there.

Case and point on chaetogrow, the contained potassium is some form with iodine, they do not list iodine as one of the suplimented micros, BUT from what I have heard, it will raise iodine levels. Given the volatility and not being imidiately available I assume that might be why, but if I was dosing a substantial amount for a very macro heavy tank, I would probably no longer need to supliment with iodide.

Also, the concentration seems fairly low, I think seachem flourish has a lot more per ml, but they also include other elements I do not want to add, so I may have to check out what others are offering.

 

[Wasabiroot]

I will agree with you there.

Case and point on chaetogrow, the contained potassium is some form with iodine, they do not list iodine as one of the suplimented micros, BUT from what I have heard, it will raise iodine levels. Given the volatility and not being imidiately available I assume that might be why, but if I was dosing a substantial amount for a very macro heavy tank, I would probably no longer need to supliment with iodide.

Also, the concentration seems fairly low, I think seachem flourish has a lot more per ml, but they also include other elements I do not want to add, so I may have to check out what others are offering.

You're likely correct. That's a good example why I wish Brightwell would be more specific with their concentration. They write 80 paragraphs in 1 pt font about what photosynthesis is but the instructions are two sentences, lol. I am cautious of freshwater planted supplements because they often contain copper unless they are labeled as "shrimp safe".

Iodine is super complex in reef tanks because it can turn to iodate, iodide, etc depending on the organics present, and it also decays quickly making it hard to test for accurately. I could see that being the case, though.

 

[KilianSP]

I have kept a pretty hands off approach to any nuisance algaes, as I personally like the look of the turfs and GHA and other green plant like things, and for pod food. Aside from early dinos, I have not manually removed anything until recently

All of my green algaes, including sea lettuce and chaeto, are melting away this last few weeks. The gha loosens from the rocks and comes off like unrilling a carpet if I tug a corner of it. I did not think haird algaes would come off in a 2inch thick matt like this. My chaeto was about the size of a basketball and is now a softball. These large gorgeous sea lettuce that appeared out if no where months ago that was absolutely thriving, which I would pluck large saycer size leaves of it and move to my sump, have stopped growing and is also now starting to melt.

I dose chaeto grow daily, i have available NO3 and Phos, I dose aminos daily, (brightwell aminos, and polyp booster) the chaeto has done great since its introduction prior to adding fish in October, until May. I have a red macro algae hitchhiker that is thriving and is showing no sign of slowing down.

Changes this last 3 months, lots of new kenya trees from babies that are growing super fast, stopped dosing O2 via oxydator, reduced kalkwasser concentration in ato water from 100 to 50%, stopped dosing phos and NO3, reduced silica dosing by 70%.

Life in tank:
Macro algae in picture
Small amounts of maroon and pink coraline
Chaeto
Sea lettuce
2 different GHA,s
Pink and red cyano deep in sandbed up against glass on the one section my engineer goby does not throw around.
A turf algae of some sort
A thing thay looks like briopsis on a turbosnail.
Film algae some of which my flipper cant scrape and I have to go in with a razor blade


Lots of feather dusters on 2 rocks
Some astrea starfish
Some limpets
Lot of amphipods and isopods
Copepods
Loads of spirobids
Some vermetids
1 blueleg hermit
1 small reef hermit

1 mandarin
2 clowns
1 engineer
4 blue chromis
1 firefish
1 cleaner shrimp
3 nassarius snails that lay thousands of eggs every day
8 astrea snails
1 turbo that is nearing tennisball size
2 trochus
3 ceriths
1 9 headed duncan with amazing polyp extension
1 4 headed frogspawn
1 candycane with 10 heads

Skimmer on constantly with CO2 scrubber recirculating
Empty oxydator
Carbon reactor that has month old rox car on in it
Ocasional felt filter sock
Powerhead in refugium for flow
Blue aquamesh to keep chaeto in fuge

I dose balling part c, sodaash and calc, keep values incredibly stable, on the high side due to low ph, 10.3 dkh and 410 calc, mag 1380.

Any thoughts?

As i only keep macroalgaes and do alot of ICP testing, i can tell you that fluoride, manganese, Iodine and Iron are the most consumed micronutrients. I would do a 80-100% waterchange or redose those elements.
As for the alkalinity, i did get my best and fastest grow when alkalinity sits around 6.0. I am always below 8.0 with my alk.
As for magnesium, you levels should never go beyond 1500mg, that stuns the grow, and even higher kills the macroalgae.
As for flow, if i have low flow, a higher nutrient level works better, for higher flow, lower nutrient levels work better.
As cheato grow contains copper and you are dosing it daily, you may have to much copper in the tank, which macroalgaes also don't like.

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

As i only keep macroalgaes and do alot of ICP testing, i can tell you that fluoride, manganese, Iodine and Iron are the most consumed micronutrients. I would do a 80-100% waterchange or redose those elements.
As for the alkalinity, i did get my best and fastest grow when alkalinity sits around 6.0. I am always below 8.0 with my alk.
As for magnesium, you levels should never go beyond 1500mg, that stuns the grow, and even higher kills the macroalgae.
As for flow, if i have low flow, a higher nutrient level works better, for higher flow, lower nutrient levels work better.
As cheato grow contains copper and you are dosing it daily, you may have to much copper in the tank, which macroalgaes also don't like.

Chaeto grow contains copper?? Are you sure?

I am going to up my water changes, I didn't do them for months due to dinos, and have been keeping them small since my nutrients were always so low.

 

[Wasabiroot]

As i only keep macroalgaes and do alot of ICP testing, i can tell you that fluoride, manganese, Iodine and Iron are the most consumed micronutrients. I would do a 80-100% waterchange or redose those elements.
As for the alkalinity, i did get my best and fastest grow when alkalinity sits around 6.0. I am always below 8.0 with my alk.
As for magnesium, you levels should never go beyond 1500mg, that stuns the grow, and even higher kills the macroalgae.
As for flow, if i have low flow, a higher nutrient level works better, for higher flow, lower nutrient levels work better.
As cheato grow contains copper and you are dosing it daily, you may have to much copper in the tank, which macroalgaes also don't like.

Don't forget potassium! A lot of reds need it

 

[paragrouper]

Chaeto grow contains copper?? Are you sure?

I am going to up my water changes, I didn't do them for months due to dinos, and have been keeping them small since my nutrients were always so low.

Copper certainly is not on their list of ingredients.

I started using ChaetoGro when my Chaeto started to wane. Thus far I have followed the instructions with great success. Mind you, my Refugium is not large (Fijicube HOB), but I do have some macro in my DT (rooted Halimeda and Pom Pom).

 

[KilianSP]

Don't forget potassium! A lot of reds need it

I don't dose it directly, mine is in my phosphate and nitrate fertilizer. And on the big tank i am doing 3 Part dosing. So no problem with potassium but always low on iron, iodine, fluoride and manganese.

 

[KilianSP]

Chaeto grow contains copper?? Are you sure?

I am going to up my water changes, I didn't do them for months due to dinos, and have been keeping them small since my nutrients were always so low.

Sorry my Bad. I don't use cheatogrow, since i am from germany, but i use an Iron fertilizer which has the same nutrients as cheatogrow, and mine contains copper in small amounts. Don't know if the amount is to small to be listed in america.
Here are the ingridients of my iron fertilizer (cheatogrow germany)

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

Don't forget potassium! A lot of reds need it

I better get an ICP done soon then. I love my red macro hitchhiker and would be bummed if it melted.

 

[vlangel]

I dose coral Vite once a week to my tank. It's a mixed reef so has a lot of coral with the macroalgae but Coral Vite has kept everything looking good.

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

I dose coral Vite once a week to my tank. It's a mixed reef so has a lot of coral with the macroalgae but Coral Vite has kept everything looking good.

I ordered more chaeto grow as I ran out, but it won't get here until tomorrow, so in the interim the last 3 days I started dosing both trace a and k grom tripic marin and it has made a huge difference in the macros already.

The red macroalgae started growing fast again noticeably within 12 hours. So I am going to keep doing that for a week and probably get an ICP to figure out where I am at.

At least the corals have looked amazing still through this. I imagine if I wasn't dosing the absolute vare minimum traces in my calc and alk solution with balling c they might have had a bad time too.

I meed to do a few ICPs I think to figure out my consumption. All of my corals are spreading so dang fast. The candycane went from 1 to 14 heads in 3 months the duncan hasn't gotten any new heads but the itty bitty mouths that barely had any extension are 2 inch monsters now. Shocked at how fast they grow. The Duncan's gonna be a dang basketball by its 1 year mark and it was a 1cm 2 headed thing when I got it in December.