Alkalinity controller without reagent! Aquawiz

[akaimal]

A few additional questions:

1. How large is the seawater reservoir? How large is the aerated sample? The question arises as to how much evaporation will result in a dry climate from aerating some portion of it over and over for weeks without checking changes due to concentrating effects and salinity.

The reservoir is one liter. The airated sample is between 10 and 20 ml I think. The water reservoir is keptair tight so chances of evaporation is minimal.

2. Borate typically accounts for a few percent of alk, and the amount depends on pH. Have you evaluated the potential error caused by variable boron levels in typical tanks? It’s not a big deal, generally, but if one is claiming accuracy levels to within 0.1 dKH or better, it likely is important.

I checked with them on the boron and they said its addressed in the product.

3. You write:

“Stability in reference seawater quality is crucial for accurate KH measurements.”

How will users know the alk stability in the reservoir for days or weeks?

As long as the water in the reservoir is stable at the beginning, it will remain stable over time. Even an unstable water source from a newly set-up tank will stabilize after a certain period. Therefore, regular monthly calibration is done after it stabilizes to thoroughly define its value. We will be more than happy to send you over a unit to you so that you can see and experience it first hand.

4. Can you clarify what the scales are on this graph you posted. It looks like the pH scale is missing.

I checked with them on this and looks like the scale of the PH graph is not defined and they just have it there for reference. The PH data is not available for customers and I have asked them to make it available.

 

[BeanAnimal]

The reservoir is one liter. The airated sample is between 10 and 20 ml I think. The water reservoir is keptair tight so chances of evaporation is minimal.

I have to wonder how is a sample aerated with room air kept "air tight" and how are room contaminates not introduced (if it matters) in such a small reservoir.

I checked with them on the boron and they said its addressed in the product.

Would be curious to understand how?

As long as the water in the reservoir is stable at the beginning, it will remain stable over time. Even an unstable water source from a newly set-up tank will stabilize after a certain period. Therefore, regular monthly calibration is done after it stabilizes to thoroughly define its value. We will be more than happy to send you over a unit to you so that you can see and experience it first hand.

I am a bit lost on the logic here, maybe just terminology if which water we are talking about, the tank water or the reservoir water.

I checked with them on this and looks like the scale of the PH graph is not defined and they just have it there for reference. The PH data is not available for customers and I have asked them to make it available.

I think we are wondering what the "scale" is because without it, the magnitude of the difference in readings can not be clearly discerned.

Thank you for providing an update.

 

[akaimal]

I don’t see why that’s worth twice the price as a kh guardian and i don’t think it will be accurate long term

The unit was reviewed by chemists in Germany and was reported as super perfect compared to competitors. More over test is done every hour and you get a flatter KH graph. More units of Aquawiz is sold in china than KHG in China. Sales in Europe is picking up fast.

 

[VintageReefer]

The unit was reviewed by chemists in Germany and was reported as super perfect compared to competitors. More over test is done every hour and you get a flatter KH graph. More units of Aquawiz is sold in china than KHG in China. Sales in Europe is picking up fast.

Khguardian can run any interval you choose. Or on a schedule. It can test every 30 min if you wanted.

Where are these reports on its reliability and accuracy compared to competitors?

Sales is irrelevant and really doesn’t mean much. Especially in this hobby and market.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The reservoir is one liter. The airated sample is between 10 and 20 ml I think. The water reservoir is keptair tight so chances of evaporation is minimal.


I checked with them on the boron and they said its addressed in the product.


As long as the water in the reservoir is stable at the beginning, it will remain stable over time. Even an unstable water source from a newly set-up tank will stabilize after a certain period. Therefore, regular monthly calibration is done after it stabilizes to thoroughly define its value. We will be more than happy to send you over a unit to you so that you can see and experience it first hand.

I checked with them on this and looks like the scale of the PH graph is not defined and they just have it there for reference. The PH data is not available for customers and I have asked them to make it available.

Of course there will be evaporation during aeration. If you test 10x per day, you will be aerating 10% of the reservoir every day. In 10 days you will have effectively aerated the whole reservoir. How much evaporation takes place during that aeration? Sounds like something you need to evaluate before users in Arizona complain about drift. The answer may be very different than if the device was tested in a more humid climate.

The pH scale on a graph you posted to convince us that CO2 doesn’t matter is undefined and it is just there for reference? What can that possibly mean? Sounds like “trust us”. Makes me distrustful. Of course it is defined. How can one make a graph on an undefined scale? If one claims it works equally well at different CO2 levels, then known what levels were evaluated in a graph showing it isn’t important is required.

They account for the unknown boron? I’m skeptical. You might argue it is a small effect, but that’s not what you claimed. If you do claim it, I’d like to know the actual calculated answer or else I’ll have to calculate it myself. It’s not the presence of borate at natural levels that is the issue, but variable levels. Perhaps ask them this different question: If borate was 10x normal, would the same pH difference giving alkalinity apply? It wouldn’t. So the question is how significant is that issue for users who may not know the boron level, or who know it is not at natural levels.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The unit was reviewed by chemists in Germany and was reported as super perfect compared to competitors. More over test is done every hour and you get a flatter KH graph. More units of Aquawiz is sold in china than KHG in China. Sales in Europe is picking up fast.

Germany is not a dry climate. Were the chemists reviewing it employed by the company now selling it there?

 

[akaimal]

Germany is not a dry climate. Were the chemists reviewing it employed by the company now selling it there?

Makes sense Randy. I will check with them on the evaporation. The units are sold by Fauna Marine in Europe and the chemist has nothing to do with them.


I will try to get more detailed answers to all the questions soon.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

By fm…..maybe they’re tuned for the fm bolus method

 

[akaimal]

The company is open to giving free units to any influencers with more than 10k followers for getting reviewed in the USA. Pease message me if you meet the requirement and interested in trying out. Thank you.

 

[BeanAnimal]

The company is open to giving free units to any influencers with more than 10k followers for getting reviewed in the USA. Pease message me if you meet the requirement and interested in trying out. Thank you.

Well I guess I am not influential and have no followers... something to aspire to so that I can get free products.

Will they sell me a unit if I am willing to pay for it?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

On the boron question, I have no doubt the values are “good enough”. It is that very low error value quoted above that I cannot get past:


2. The error margin is less than 0.03, outperforming most brands.

I presume that is dKH. That is only about 0.4% error. That is a very high bar, and I’m skeptical of it being true for unknown and variable levels of boron at different CO2 levels in the air.

I’m also skeptical that the aeration with dry air does not cause greater than 0.4% evaporation and hence error all by itself.

Heres what I suggest the developers do;

1. Aerate samples ten times a day for a month using typical dry air (either in a desert environment or a home in a cold climate in winter). Looks to see how much the reservoir reduces in size.

2. Add 10x the normal amount of boron as sodium borate. Measure total alk by titration, then use this machine to measure the alk as if it were a normal aquarium, at normal outside CO2 and using air with a reasonably high CO2 (say, 1200 ppm). Then compare the measured alk values.

 

[wjm6449]

If it sounds too good to be true…..

 

[akaimal]

Well I guess I am not influential and have no followers... something to aspire to so that I can get free products.

Will they sell me a unit if I am willing to pay for it?

For sure. Please PM me and I will arrange a unit for you. Thanks,.

 

[akaimal]

On the boron question, I have no doubt the values are “good enough”. It is that very low error value quoted above that I cannot get past:


2. The error margin is less than 0.03, outperforming most brands.

I presume that is dKH. That is only about 0.4% error. That is a very high bar, and I’m skeptical of it being true for unknown and variable levels of boron at different CO2 levels in the air.

I’m also skeptical that the aeration with dry air does not cause greater than 0.4% evaporation and hence error all by itself.

Heres what I suggest the developers do;

1. Aerate samples ten times a day for a month using typical dry air (either in a desert environment or a home in a cold climate in winter). Looks to see how much the reservoir reduces in size.

2. Add 10x the normal amount of boron as sodium borate. Measure total alk by titration, then use this machine to measure the alk as if it were a normal aquarium, at normal outside CO2 and using air with a reasonably high CO2 (say, 1200 ppm). Then compare the measured alk values.

Sure will do that. Also a coral farm in Mojave Desert in southern California got two units from us a few months ago and have been using it also. I will get there feed back or ask them to post here. Thanks.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

The issue seems, using it in a dry climate vs humid climate would yeild differing levels of accuracy.

I'm in Arizona and it sounds like, I would experience somewhat accurate results at first, but would slowly trend to innacurate as excessive evaporation isn't taken into account. I would have no way to compare that to a humid climate without setting up a test environment. It sounds like using a rubber ruler to justify claims.

I guess a comparison from time to time with an acceptable means of testing would be easy enough to monitor the drift of accuracy. I wonder if the coral farmer in the Mojave desert uses a simular method to validate the results.

 

[desertmike]

Hi folks
Akaimal asked me to share my experience w the Aquawiz, I have been running it for 6 months. I have a professional Coral farm 1700 gallon total.
I live in the Mojave desert. Evaporation no problem I think the water in the unit cycles through anyways and gets refilled/replaced.
It works so well I tend to forget to calibrate. Longest no calibration was 7 weeks or so I was off by less than .75 DKH
I LOVE the hourly testing!

I also run a trident on my other system, I use ABC reagents but A only and ignore B and C. For 35 bucks you can buy powder for reagent A that will last like 2 years or so. This is also a cost effective way just sayin.
But the Aquawiz with no reagents even better.

Happy reefing!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I live in the Mojave desert. Evaporation no problem I think the water in the unit cycles through anyways and gets refilled/replaced.
It works so well I tend to forget to calibrate. Longest no calibration was 7 weeks or so I was off by less than .75 DKH
I LOVE the hourly testing!

Thanks for the info.

IMO, that's a far more reasonable value than the 0.03 dKH accuracy quoted earlier. Exaggerating the accuracy is really not a good plan for a new device.

The fact that the reservoir gets replaced (if true) is certainly a different situation with respect to evaporation, but brings it's own causes for drift if a calibration is not done each time the new water gets into it.

 

[akaimal]

Thanks for the info.

IMO, that's a far more reasonable value than the 0.03 dKH accuracy quoted earlier. Exaggerating the accuracy is really not a good plan for a new device.

The fact that the reservoir gets replaced (if true) is certainly a different situation with respect to evaporation, but brings it's own causes for drift if a calibration is not done each time the new water gets into it.

Hi folks
Akaimal asked me to share my experience w the Aquawiz, I have been running it for 6 months. I have a professional Coral farm 1700 gallon total.
I live in the Mojave desert. Evaporation no problem I think the water in the unit cycles through anyways and gets refilled/replaced.
It works so well I tend to forget to calibrate. Longest no calibration was 7 weeks or so I was off by less than .75 DKH
I LOVE the hourly testing!

I also run a trident on my other system, I use ABC reagents but A only and ignore B and C. For 35 bucks you can buy powder for reagent A that will last like 2 years or so. This is also a cost effective way just sayin.
But the Aquawiz with no reagents even better.

Happy reefing!

Thank you for the feed back. The accuracy drifted to .75 DKH when it was not calibrated for 7 weeks right? The unit is supposed to be calibrated once a month to stay accurate. During the first 4 weeks was the machine far more accurate?

 

[akaimal]

I don’t see why that’s worth twice the price as a kh guardian and i don’t think it will be accurate long term

We have reduced the price to $744 for the USA market after receiving feedback.