125-gallon Peaceful Reef

Due to acquisition of two Marineland 125-gallon tanks, my build plan has changed significantly.
Current plan is to have a 125-reef with a 125-sump with the main chamber for a macroalgae display.
Screenshot of 3D-model of current plan (2021-10-04 16:06):

Spoiler: Previous post updates

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QT Update 2021-11-23:

Stand painted 2021-11-13 (now in my dining room 2021-11-20):

Living room FOWLR is being transferred to the basement:

Now for 90-Display/75-sump FOWLR for my basement fish room:

Spoiler: Basement FOWLR 90-Display 75-Sump

Last Update as of 2021-03-17 10:38
Floor drilled for plumbing down to basement "fish room" (2021-03-16 20:30):

Current FOWLR and in-progress setup photo from this morning (2021-03-10):

Backdrop outdoor posters received for mangrove lagoon and 90-gallon reef (2021-03-08):

Current Fish Stocking List as of 2021-03-11 17:42
Current planned fish list:
90-gallon reef:
1X Fiji Bicolor Foxface (Siganus uspi)
2X Darwin Ocellaris Clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris)
2X Royal Gramma (Gramma loreto)
2X Sharknose Gobies (Elcatinus evelynae)
1X Rainsford's Goby (Amblygobius rainfordi)
1X Orangespotted Shrimp Goby (Amblyeleotris guttata)
1X Bristletooth Tomini Tang (Ctenochaetus tominiensis)
3X Yellowstriped Cardinalfish (Ostorhincus cyanosoma) or Seal's Cardinalfish (Ostorhincus sealei)
2X Scissortail Dartfish (Ptereleotris evides)
1X Melanurus Wrasse (Halichoerus melanurus)
1X Engineer Goby (Pholidichthys leucotaenia)

75-gallon mangrove lagoon:
1X Purple Tang (Zebrasoma xanthurum) [already in FOWLR]
1X Rectangle Triggerfish (Rhinecanthus rectangulus) [already in FOWLR]
1X Snowflake Eel (Echidna nebulosa) [already in FOWLR]
1X One Spot Foxface (Siganus unimaculatus)
1X Pink Streaked Wrasse (Pseudocheilinops ataenia)

~40-gallon Sump Refugium Section:
2X Janss' Pipefish (Doryrhamphus janssi)
2X Spotted Mandarinfish (Synchiropus picturatus)

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Planned layout (shorter stand will be standard rather than custom-built):

75-gallon mangrove lagoon and 90-gallon display are both drilled for Modular Marine 1200gph overflows (awaiting setup and installation). (2021-01-21)

Stand Frame finished and awaiting skin, trim, and countertop (2021-01-04):

UPDATES as of 2020-12-07 13:00
Modular Marine 1200GPH overflows shipping soon, fish list being revised and researched, materials for stand are in my shop waiting for fabrication, most equipment is sourced and on-hand for progress over holiday break

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ORIGINAL POST
After being introduced to keeping a marine aquarium with the acquisition of a 75-gallon FOWLR from a co-worker as detailed in my post in the Meet & Greet forum, I am just starting the planning phase of building a 90-gallon peaceful reef tank.
Since I am new, I am planning to start with more hardy fishes, corals, and invertebrates. Research is one thing I enjoy doing, so I will be careful and patient in the planning phase to reduce likelihood of wasted expense and failures when I am starting out.

I already have the tank (48 inches long, 18 inches wide, 25 inches deep) and stand with an open base design that should allow for a sump. There are no holes drilled in the aquarium for plumbing, so I will probably need overflow over the top, unless drilling through the glass is a consideration I take. A sump with a refugium is very likely to be included (30 to 55 gallons, not sure how to size the sump? ...is bigger better?).
80-lbs of dry rock, 40-lbs of Caribsea Arag-alive Fiji Pink, and 20-lbs of Caribsea Arag-alive Special Grade are on order so I can get rockscape and substrate ready to begin cycling in the next month or two. I am in no rush, but I would like to have the materials on hand when I am ready to start this tank, especially if there is any pre-setup processing I need to do.

This is my initial fish list based on preliminary research, and recommendations for additions, subtractions, or changes are appreciated.
Listed in approximate order of preference:
2 of Black and White Ocellaris Clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris)
1 of Purple Tang (Zebrasoma xanthurum) [I already have this ~4-inch fish that will be transferred over from my 75-gallon]
1 of Kole Yellow Eye Tang (Ctenochaetus strigosus) or 1 of Bristletooth Tomini Tang (Ctenochaetus tominiensis)
1 of Foxface Lo (Siganus vulpinus) or 1 of Bicolor Foxface (Siganus uspi) or 1 of One Spot Foxface (Siganus unimaculatus)
1-2 of Engineer Goby (Pholidichthys leucotaenia)
2-3 of Chalk Bass (Serranus tortugarum)
2-3 of Neon Goby (Elcatinus oceanops)
2-4 of Yellowstriped Cardinalfish (Ostorhincus cyanosoma)
2 of Blue/Green Black-axil Chromis (Chromis sp.) or 2 of Yellowtail Damselfish (Chrysiptera parasema) or 2 of Blue Sapphire Damselfish (Chrysiptera cf. springeri)

Some items on this list are probably not subject to change. My favorite fish is the Black and White Ocellaris Clownfish, especially paired symbiotically with Rose Bubble-Tip Anemones. These two fish along with RBTA are surely on my list.
The Purple Tang came with the 75-gallon tank I got and is one of my most favorite fish, so I would like him to be in the 90-gallon reef (at least until he may grow too large?).
Fish from the genus Siganus I find particularly striking and interesting, so one will likely be included.
The Engineer Goby is one of my favorites also for its coloration and resemblance to an eel. I am not sure if it is better to include two or only one.
The Chalk Bass is my favorite small fish and would like to include more than one.
The other fish are just considerations for different colors or interests if they can be added without overcrowding the tank or overloading the biosystem.
I really like eels, and my 75-gallon aquarium came with a ~11-inch Snowflake Eel, but it seems they are not good to add to a 90-gallon reef. Since I also have triggerfish that are not compatible with the reef, I will probably leave the 75-gallon as a FOWLR in addition to the 90-gallon reef aquarium.

Does this seem way too heavy a bio-load for a 90-gallon tank (probably with a 30-to-55-gallon sump)? Should I remove fish or can I add fish (either more quantity or more types) to the list? What sequence should I add the fish to best aid success?

I am not really sure which corals to include, so I am open to suggestions. I want hardy beginner corals at the start and will see where I head from here in the future.
My initial research has me considering the following, though much more research and recommendations are needed before adding any:
Mushroom Anemones, branching Sinularia, Porites, Leather, Acropora (maybe too difficult?), Star Polyps, Euphyllia (especially ancora)
Corals are one category where I am very open to recommendations.

Other invertebrates, such as hermit crabs, snails, shrimp, starfish, urchins, conchs will be included for clean-up, though I am also very open to suggestions in this area and will refine considerations as I make a more specific plan for the fishes and corals that are to be included.

Thanks in advance for any recommendations, especially initial reactions to my considerations. I know this is broad right now, but I will get more specific in considerations and schedule as I progress in my research. I have been reading a lot about reefing and marine aquariums online and in books and will continue to do so in conjunction with recommendations on R2R for a practical education towards a successful reef.

Current Aquascape awaiting cementing (2020-12-07):

Cemented Aquascape (2021-01-23):

33-gallon Brute can ready for pre-cycling rock, sand, and aquascape (2021-01-23):

Aquascape start-cycle in progress (2021-01-28):

Kind Regards,
Soren

 

[Goaway]

i would type more, 3 yr old being clingy.
i have cheap bio balls. they just sink, i think they are supposed to kind of float and tumble?

 

[Soren]

i would type more, 3 yr old being clingy.
i have cheap bio balls. they just sink, i think they are supposed to kind of float and tumble?

I suppose that makes sense if they work sort of like a wheel biofilter found on HOB filters. Maybe I should let them tumble around.

 

[Soren]

I was hoping the yumas were in your photos. unless you got more to post.

Missed this earlier, sorry, I posted all the pictures I took (or best of similar photos), so I must have missed the yumas...

 

[Goaway]

Missed this earlier, sorry, I posted all the pictures I took (or best of similar photos), so I must have missed the yumas...

Frank has pics identical to ao shop. bright orange, i wonder if yumas though
edit yes they are.

 

[1ocean]

i would type more, 3 yr old being clingy.
i have cheap bio balls. they just sink, i think they are supposed to kind of float and tumble?

yes they suppose to float and or tumble if you have the water flow.
I have some in chamber 3 of my sumps and just enough in each to keep them off the bottom of the sump so I can see when it is time to siphon off the bottom of the chamber

 

[1ocean]

These are pic of the two sumps without water in them. The bio balls float and leave me about 2 inch of just water from the bottom.

 

[Soren]

yes they suppose to float and or tumble if you have the water flow.
I have some in chamber 3 of my sumps and just enough in each to keep them off the bottom of the sump so I can see when it is time to siphon off the bottom of the chamber

So this means they are not ideal for a QT (or tank with no sump)? I don't think I'd like it if the bioballs were loose and tumbling on the surface of the QT, so I may just increase my bio-active sponge filter population for QT startups. I may also use some HOB filters with bioballs instead of the normal filter pads.

As I found, though, the bioballs may be in excess of what I actually needed for my QT. I just may not have had enough time for the sponge filter to be fully bio-active to carry the load I added since I set up my QT in a hurry to remove the undulate triggerfish from my FOWLR. Now, there is no detectable nitrites and almost no nitrates in my QT's, so I may remove the bioballs and just keep them seeded in their own tank for bacteria-populated biomedia. Large sponge filters and a few bioballs in a HOB filter should be enough for my QT needs.

 

[1ocean]

So this means they are not ideal for a QT (or tank with no sump)? I don't think I'd like it if the bioballs were loose and tumbling on the surface of the QT, so I may just increase my bio-active sponge filter population for QT startups. I may also use some HOB filters with bioballs instead of the normal filter pads.

As I found, though, the bioballs may be in excess of what I actually needed for my QT. I just may not have had enough time for the sponge filter to be fully bio-active to carry the load I added since I set up my QT in a hurry to remove the undulate triggerfish from my FOWLR. Now, there is no detectable nitrites and almost no nitrates in my QT's, so I may remove the bioballs and just keep them seeded in their own tank for bacteria-populated biomedia. Large sponge filters and a few bioballs in a HOB filter should be enough for my QT needs.

yep, I would not use bio balls in a QT tank just floating in the tank as you mentioned, since will all dose some sort of chem to treat fish in a QT.
I agree large foam filters and or the addition of some bio balls in HOB to ensure bacteria population is a good combo.. Just my opinion, i would do that on mine...
Again it is all about what info we all can learn from each other and which suggestions work for us individually....
Have a super great day

 

[Soren]

yep, I would not use bio balls in a QT tank just floating in the tank as you mentioned, since will all dose some sort of chem to treat fish in a QT.
I agree large foam filters and or the addition of some bio balls in HOB to ensure bacteria population is a good combo.. Just my opinion, i would do that on mine...
Again it is all about what info we all can learn from each other and which suggestions work for us individually....
Have a super great day

Thanks for the recommendation!

I plan to remove the bioball bags from my 2nd QT today after this recent discussion and your recommendation. The tank will look nicer without them, though the main reason I included them in the 2nd QT thus far was because the fish liked having them as a wall to hide behind. Now that I have resin "rocks" in the QT's that are medication-safe, I should not need the bioballs for a hiding place anymore.

The 1st QT already only has a large sponge filter and my 3D-printed PET-G mesh plates on the bottom for biological filtration surface area. It looks much nicer without the bags of bioballs.

 

[Soren]

Kind of disappointed today...
Last evening, I discovered my small Tomini tang dead on his side on the live rock. I did not see him out in the morning when I fed the fish. There were no signs of damage or sickness evident other than slight deterioration at the fringes of the fins (which may have been after death, since it could have been ~24 hours from death until I discovered it...).
Shortly after removing and inspecting the Tomini, I noticed my smallest Fiji foxface flopped at an odd angle against the resin rock... upon removal to a hospital bucket, the foxface just layed on its side on the bottom or moved about on the flow, just barely moving fins and breathing shallow, rapid breaths. Its stomach was quite pinched. This morning, it was staying still in one place with its tail against the intake sponge of a small pump I added for water movement in the hospital bucket. It may have died before I left for work, but it was breathing shortly before I left and I did not have any more time to check further.

So, observations and more information:
Both quarantine tanks were dosed with PraziPro last Wednesday evening. Both tanks have low pH (~7.5 on API 5-in-1 strips). Due to low pH, I suspected CO2 build-up as a possibility and assumed the fish may have elevated breathing due to low oxygen (which I know to be a possibility when dosing PraziPro or similar medications). I have the tanks in the basement, so I was also concerned that the air in the room is not fresh enough. I added an air pump in my living room with an airline down to an airstone in each quarantine. The next day, the water in the 2nd quarantine with sand started to appear a bit milky (not much, but looked whiter than clear water), which I assumed was either bubbles being split down by the powerheads or the beginnings of a bacterial bloom. This was on Monday. Tuesday, nothing seemed worse or off about the quarantines other than that I did not see the Tomini tang at the morning feeding. Tuesday evening is when I noticed the death/issues mentioned above.

The Tomini was pretty small, but all appearances beforehand were that of a healthy, active fish. The same was true for the smallest foxface. Both were observed to be eating, but both were somewhat thin when I got them. No aggression between foxfaces has been observed, but there is still a chance that the smallest did not eat as much because of submission to the larger ones (though nori has been available almost non-stop since adding the foxfaces to the quarantine and all have been observed eating nori).

Now, I may set up several 10-gallon quarantines in order to completely isolate fish when necessary for individual attention such as specialized feeding.

I know there are bound to be some disappointments in this hobby, and I was pushing limits if not breaking the rule of being patient, but it is even more disappointing when I feel like I might have been able to do something to possibly prevent the deaths even though both were sudden with no indications before death or obvious and probably lethal symptoms.

Both on the live fish and on the dead/sickly fish, I see no obvious signs of disease or wounds of any type.

I'll be watching the other fish closely (all still seem to be doing well enough from all outward appearances) and will be improving my quarantine process and setup before any new additions. I'm also heavily leaning towards practicing more patience and leaving off any new acquisitions until my 125-125 plan is actually set up, plumbed, and cycling for the intended bioload. I still plan to quarantine all new acquisitions, but I will try to more-closely follow the steps recommended by @Jay Hemdal and the 15 steps for starting a reef as outlined by @Lasse.

One strange thing, though probably coincidence, is that both fish that died are the ones I got from my LFS. This is likely coincidence, though, since the Tomini tang was tiny (~1.5")and young and the foxface was the smallest of the group (~3" long compared to the others at 3.5"-4.5"). The Tomini tang was in this same quarantine since Saturday, 2021-10-30 and the smaller Fiji foxface was added to the first quarantine on Saturday, 2021-10-09 and was transferred to the 2nd quarantine on Monday, 2021-11-01.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

So this means they are not ideal for a QT (or tank with no sump)? I don't think I'd like it if the bioballs were loose and tumbling on the surface of the QT, so I may just increase my bio-active sponge filter population for QT startups. I may also use some HOB filters with bioballs instead of the normal filter pads.

As I found, though, the bioballs may be in excess of what I actually needed for my QT. I just may not have had enough time for the sponge filter to be fully bio-active to carry the load I added since I set up my QT in a hurry to remove the undulate triggerfish from my FOWLR. Now, there is no detectable nitrites and almost no nitrates in my QT's, so I may remove the bioballs and just keep them seeded in their own tank for bacteria-populated biomedia. Large sponge filters and a few bioballs in a HOB filter should be enough for my QT needs.

What about taking a piece of 3-in PVC (maybe 2' long) and plumb it in line to your return? Fill it 75%with your bio balls, The water would need to pass through and around them.

There's probably multiple problems with that, Just an off the head thought.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Thanks for the recommendation!

I plan to remove the bioball bags from my 2nd QT today after this recent discussion and your recommendation. The tank will look nicer without them, though the main reason I included them in the 2nd QT thus far was because the fish liked having them as a wall to hide behind. Now that I have resin "rocks" in the QT's that are medication-safe, I should not need the bioballs for a hiding place anymore.

The 1st QT already only has a large sponge filter and my 3D-printed PET-G mesh plates on the bottom for biological filtration surface area. It looks much nicer without the bags of bioballs.

What sort of non-calcerous rock are you using in the QT?

 

[Soren]

What about taking a piece of 3-in PVC (maybe 2' long) and plumb it in line to your return? Fill it 75%with your bio balls, The water would need to pass through and around them.

There's probably multiple problems with that, Just an off the head thought.

Thanks for the suggestion, Lost. I considered doing something like this to make a bioball "reactor", but it will probably not be necessary since I should have room in my sump of my 125-125 build to just leave bioballs loose and the sponge filters should be enough for my quarantines. The use of bioballs was prompted by a fear caused by too little time for the bacteria to multiply in my initial QT. Now, both QT's are running at undetectable levels of both nitrites and nitrates on an API 5-in-1 test strip.

The bioballs should certainly be unnecessary in my 125-125 build and will be only for seeding by transfer to new QT/hospital tanks as necessary in the future.

What sort of non-calcerous rock are you using in the QT?

They are rocks made from resin. I bought them on chewy.com: Underwater Treasure Pitted Rock Wall
I got 2 of each size, 1 large and 1 small for each QT, and I think they look very nice for a QT! I almost bought more, but decided not to spend the money yet just for more motivation to expand and multiply my QT's too quickly...

Look at this post if you want to see them in use in my 40-gallon-breeder quarantines.

Edit: I just noticed that the large ones are currently out of stock.

 

[Goaway]

Keep an eye out for rapid gill movement. I would like to believe it is not velvet. And something else taking place. Velvet doesn't always need to be seen, it can suffocate the fish as gills are easiest to infect.

 

[Soren]

Keep an eye out for rapid gill movement. I would like to believe it is not velvet. And something else taking place. Velvet doesn't always need to be seen, it can suffocate the fish as gills are easiest to infect.

I've been watching for velvet, but so far have not seen any other symptoms than rapid gill movement/breathing. I'm hoping that is not what it is; the fish have been showing somewhat elevated breathing for at least a week. This was the trigger to dosing PraziPro in case of gill flukes (does not seem to be the case).

I would be due for a second PraziPro dose tonight or in the next couple days to ensure that anything hatched from eggs might also be killed, but I have not seem any actual symptoms of flukes other than elevated breathing and I am much more concerned that the PraziPro spikes a bacterial bloom and limits water oxygenation. I am seriously considering running a pipe and fan through my basement window space to bring in fresh air in case this is the issue (this would then cause a heating issue, though...).

I'm almost considering trying to relocate my QT's to my living room, but this would be a challenging task and would get in the way of my near-final stages of house remodel.

 

[Goaway]

Prazi causes the need of a lot aeration. Hopefully nothing else occurs.

 

[Soren]

Prazi causes the need of a lot aeration. Hopefully nothing else occurs.

Yes, I am aware of this, thanks for the recommendation. This is exactly why I added airstones plumbed from my living room and also why I don't know if I want to do another dose of PraziPro after the recent pH drop/bacterial bloom?/fish deaths.

I'm hoping low oxygen was the only reason the two fish died and that it was because they were the smallest and weakest fish (for their species at least, since the juvenile clownfish and juvenile engineer gobies are still doing fine...).

I still feel like I should have done better, but at least it is motivating me to improve my basement QT setups.

 

[Goaway]

I still feel like I should have done better, but at least it is motivating me to improve my basement QT setups.

Don't feel like that, there are too many elements out of our control. Collection methods, the time a fish has had a pinched belly, that does matter. When I buy new fish, if they survive 14 days. I am pretty confident they are going to be with me a lot longer. Usually, most ill fish die in our tanks with in those 14 days.

Also, how long a fish has been starved. This leads to their liver being consumed. They are now on borrowed time.

Edit : first sign of low oxygen for me is the fish at the surface of water, applies to salt and fresh.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Thanks for the suggestion, Lost. I considered doing something like this to make a bioball "reactor", but it will probably not be necessary since I should have room in my sump of my 125-125 build to just leave bioballs loose and the sponge filters should be enough for my quarantines. The use of bioballs was prompted by a fear caused by too little time for the bacteria to multiply in my initial QT. Now, both QT's are running at undetectable levels of both nitrites and nitrates on an API 5-in-1 test strip.

The bioballs should certainly be unnecessary in my 125-125 build and will be only for seeding by transfer to new QT/hospital tanks as necessary in the future.


They are rocks made from resin. I bought them on chewy.com: Underwater Treasure Pitted Rock Wall
I got 2 of each size, 1 large and 1 small for each QT, and I think they look very nice for a QT! I almost bought more, but decided not to spend the money yet just for more motivation to expand and multiply my QT's too quickly...

Look at this post if you want to see them in use in my 40-gallon-breeder quarantines.

Edit: I just noticed that the large ones are currently out of stock.

Good stuff man. I like these.. the large is a lot bigger than I thought it would be.

Ill probably be running a permanent qt for the foreseeable future (although hopefully back to a 20 g, from a 40 breeder soon)

I can see myself using two smalls.

 

[Soren]

Don't feel like that, there are too many elements out of our control. Collection methods, the time a fish has had a pinched belly, that does matter. When I buy new fish, if they survive 14 days. I am pretty confident they are going to be with me a lot longer. Usually, most ill fish die in our tanks with in those 14 days.

Also, how long a fish has been starved. This leads to their liver being consumed. They are now on borrowed time.

Edit : first sign of low oxygen for me is the fish at the surface of water, applies to salt and fresh.

I know there are a lot of elements beyond our control. This did make me question collection methods and liver issues or feeding issues. I forgot to ask to see the fish eating before buying, although they both seemed to be eating in my QT. I will be setting up and plumbing some 10 gallon tanks so that I can give special attention to individual fish in the future. I noticed this smallest foxface was thinner than the others and just hoped it would improve over time. I will never know what caused the death, but I will try to learn more to prevent similar situations in the future.

For both/all of the fish in my QT's, I have never seen them breathing at the surface. They do not even come to the surface when I feed flakes for diversity (primary foods are frozen and nori). They just wait for food to be in the water column or sunken to the bottom.

Good stuff man. I like these.. the large is a lot bigger than I thought it would be.

Ill probably be running a permanent qt for the foreseeable future (although hopefully back to a 20 g, from a 40 breeder soon)

I can see myself using two smalls.

I highly recommend them as a great addition for QT tanks. They look a lot like bare reef rock. Either 2 smalls or 1 large would be good for a 20-gallon tank, though the large might actually be too tall for a 20-gallon long tank.