Yellowfin Flasher wrasse not doing good in QT

[sck90]

Hello,

I have a Yellow fin flasher wrasse currently in QT tank. It is in 2.18 ppm copperpower since last Monday (so, 5th day in copper). A Flame hawkfish is also in QT with the wrasse. Qt tank is a 10 gal with sponge filter (cycled in dt tank 6 weeks before starting Qt). Ammonia is good according to seachem badge. Temp is 80 F.

Before starting copper, the fish have been in tank for 12 days. I started a Paracleanse (which is identical to general cure) treatment day 2, then another treatment day 10, then started copper on Day 12. Both fish have been Eating very well from Day 1 to Day 11. No sign of copper intolerance before today. I decided to do Paracleanse first since I know both fish are prone to flukes and since they were in lfs for at least a week with no sign of ich or velvet.

Today morning, wrasse was lying on the bottom of the tank. He didnt eat today (I tried twice). Flame hawkfish is eating and acting normal. I still put the Hawkfish in an acclimatation box inside the QT, because I saw him chasing the wrasse a few times (but the wrasse was eating very fine anyway).

Please see video of the wrasse.

Should I pull it out of copper asap ? What would be your best advices ?

Thank you.

Sam

 

[Dread Pirate Dave]

I've never had that wrasse myself.

@vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal help please.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello,

I have a Yellow fin flasher wrasse currently in QT tank. It is in 2.18 ppm copperpower since last Monday (so, 5th day in copper). A Flame hawkfish is also in QT with the wrasse. Qt tank is a 10 gal with sponge filter (cycled in dt tank 6 weeks before starting Qt). Ammonia is good according to seachem badge. Temp is 80 F.

Before starting copper, the fish have been in tank for 12 days. I started a Paracleanse (which is identical to general cure) treatment day 2, then another treatment day 10, then started copper on Day 12. Both fish have been Eating very well from Day 1 to Day 11. No sign of copper intolerance before today. I decided to do Paracleanse first since I know both fish are prone to flukes and since they were in lfs for at least a week with no sign of ich or velvet.

Today morning, wrasse was lying on the bottom of the tank. He didnt eat today (I tried twice). Flame hawkfish is eating and acting normal. I still put the Hawkfish in an acclimatation box inside the QT, because I saw him chasing the wrasse a few times (but the wrasse was eating very fine anyway).

Please see video of the wrasse.

Should I pull it out of copper asap ? What would be your best advices ?

Thank you.

Sam

My apology for using this term but patacleanse is garbage and rarely if ever works despite manufacturer claims. Best would have been to begin with coppersafe at 2.15-2.25 and I encourage you to get a physical water test taking a water sample to a store that does NOT use Api kits and have them test your ammonia and nitrates and compare readings- then you'll know where your levels truly are at. I do not trust badges after 2 weeks of use and especially when in medication as its designed for freshwater also
This fish may fare better if provided a small bowl of fine sand to burrow into
Can you provide video of fish under white light intensity ?

 

[sck90]

UPDATE

I just moved the fish in a 5 gal bucket with water from my inverts QT because the wrasse was really not feeling good. It was vertical, head on the bottom in the egg crate. Maybe should I put it in the inverts QT (but now my inverts qt clock would restart).

 

[sck90]

My apology for using this term but patacleanse is garbage and rarely if ever works despite manufacturer claims. Best would have been to begin with coppersafe at 2.15-2.25 and I encourage you to get a physical water test taking a water sample to a store that does NOT use Api kits and have them test your ammonia and nitrates and compare readings- then you'll know where your levels truly are at. I do not trust badges after 2 weeks of use and especially when in medication as its designed for freshwater also
This fish may fare better if provided a small bowl of fine sand to burrow into
Can you provide video of fish under white light intensity ?

Thanks for the response. This is the only medic that contains praziquantel I could get my hands on un Canada. Anyway if my ammonia was the problem, the flame hawkfish would also be affected. I did another fish qt a month ago with absolutely no problem using this sponge filter.

Flasher wrasse dont burry in sand as far as I know...

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thanks for the response. This is the only medic that contains praziquantel I could get my hands on un Canada. Anyway if my ammonia was the problem, the flame hawkfish would also be affected. I did another fish qt a month ago with absolutely no problem using this sponge filter.

Flasher wrasse dont burry in sand as far as I know...

Flasher does not but it will offer cover if it desires. Did not realize Canada but General cure also has low level and with prazi for flukes, we have not confirmed flukes. hence request for video

 

[sck90]

Flasher does not but it will offer cover if it desires. Did not realize Canada but General cure also has low level and with prazi for flukes, we have not confirmed flukes. hence request for video

I already posted a video first post, should I do another one ? I think the problem now really is copper intoxication knowing that wrasses are more copper sensitive...

 

[sck90]

Here is the wrasse in water without copper (coming from my invert QT).

 

[vetteguy53081]

Here is the wrasse in water without copper (coming from my invert QT).

I could not open it on my device but am at my computer shortly

 

[vetteguy53081]

Here is the wrasse in water without copper (coming from my invert QT).

Video does not play

 

[sck90]

Video does not play

Strange ! It plays both on my cellphone and computer... Will try to film again later or tomorrow.

I just did set up a temporary quarantine in a 5 gal bucket with heater, little powerhead, and one of the sponges that were in my hob filter on my main qt. Let's hope the wrasse survives during the night...

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Strange ! It plays both on my cellphone and computer... Will try to film again later or tomorrow.

I just did set up a temporary quarantine in a 5 gal bucket with heater, little powerhead, and one of the sponges that were in my hob filter on my main qt. Let's hope the wrasse survives during the night...

It looks like the wrasse is breathing faster in the second video than in the first - transport stress I suppose.

It is unlikely to be an issue with copper. I hear a lot of comments that wrasses are sensitive to prazi. I’ve never seen this in my own systems, but I can’t discount those reports out of hand.

 

[sck90]

It looks like the wrasse is breathing faster in the second video than in the first - transport stress I suppose.

It is unlikely to be an issue with copper. I hear a lot of comments that wrasses are sensitive to prazi. I’ve never seen this in my own systems, but I can’t discount those reports out of hand.

Thanks for the response.

Good to know that the copper treatment might not be the issue. Prazi should now be pretty much out of the system since last Paracleanse dose was last friday (one week ago). What is making you say the copper is unlikely to be problematic ?

Should I try to put the wrasse back in the copper qt tomorrow if it is feeling?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thanks for the response.

Good to know that the copper treatment might not be the issue. Prazi should now be pretty much out of the system since last Paracleanse dose was last friday (one week ago). What is making you say the copper is unlikely to be problematic ?

Should I try to put the wrasse back in the copper qt tomorrow if it is feeling?

I’ve dosed hundreds of wrasses of this and related genera with amine based copper with no signs of toxicity. Ionic copper is another issue entirely.

The issue with wrasses and prazi is most likely related to low dissolved oxygen. I always run strong air stones in quarantine tanks, (an old school thing) but many people now don’t do that. Bacterial action breaks down prazi and that consumes oxygen. Wrasses have high oxygen requirements, so I think that’s the issue.

I wouldn’t put the wrasse back in copper though - there could be something else in the tank that is messing up the wrasse, or maybe your wrasse IS sensitive to copper. I’d give it a few days to see if it turns around.

 

[Tamberav]

I see some nips out of the fins it looks like. If the other fish was chasing it, would probably compound issues, especially low O2.

 

[sck90]

I’ve dosed hundreds of wrasses of this and related genera with amine based copper with no signs of toxicity. Ionic copper is another issue entirely.

The issue with wrasses and prazi is most likely related to low dissolved oxygen. I always run strong air stones in quarantine tanks, (an old school thing) but many people now don’t do that. Bacterial action breaks down prazi and that consumes oxygen. Wrasses have high oxygen requirements, so I think that’s the issue.

I wouldn’t put the wrasse back in copper though - there could be something else in the tank that is messing up the wrasse, or maybe your wrasse IS sensitive to copper. I’d give it a few days to see if it turns around.

Perfect. Thank you very much for your time. I will post updates in the next days.

 

[sck90]

I see some nips out of the fins it looks like. If the other fish was chasing it, would probably compound issues, especially low O2.

Thanks. I will probably put the wrasse back in QT tank when the hawkfish treatment is done.