Very Simple SPS Tank - no magic juices - Looking for experiences

[Punchanello]

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to draw on your experience. I'm an intermediate reefer. I have a Shallow 3x2 ft waterbox which has been running for over a year now. Plenty of light and flow and fully stocked with fish. I'm about to start stocking it with SPS frags.

Partly to reduce costs, but primarily to reduce complexity and unknowns, I want to experiment with this tank being an ultra simple, no magic juices build and see what kind of results I get with SPS. What I mean by that is -

- 10% water changes weekly for dilution and additional elements
- Randy's recipe for the big three
- steady alternate light cycle kalk drip for pH
- activated carbon
- Chaeto for nutrient export.
- Skimmer

Has anyone got any experience running a tank like this or something similar? How did you go (pics welcome)? Any advice, cautionary tales or suggestions?

 

[slingfox]

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to draw on your experience. I'm an intermediate reefer. I have a Shallow 3x2 ft waterbox which has been running for over a year now. Plenty of light and flow and fully stocked with fish. I'm about to start stocking it with SPS frags.

Partly to reduce costs, but primarily to reduce complexity and unknowns, I want to experiment with this tank being an ultra simple, no magic juices build and see what kind of results I get with SPS. What I mean by that is -

- 10% water changes weekly for dilution and additional elements
- Randy's recipe for the big three
- steady alternate light cycle kalk drip for pH
- activated carbon
- Chaeto for nutrient export.
- Skimmer

Has anyone got any experience running a tank like this or something similar? How did you go (pics welcome)? Any advice, cautionary tales or suggestions?

Sounds like a good setup full of magic juices (eg, self-mixed 3-part, kalk mix) and definitely not what most could consider "ultra simple" I have a feeling a tank upgrade is in your future!

 

[Punchanello]

Sounds like a good setup full of magic juices (eg, self-mixed 3-part, kalk mix) and definitely not what most could consider "ultra simple" I have a feeling a tank upgrade is in your future!

Fair enough

I guess what I mean by that is I'm not intending to start dumping in aminos, trace elements or moonshining just because I can. I may consider those things later if things aren't going well and I'm confident I've got stability and the basics right.

 

[Big E]

I've been keeping acros for 24 years and have a similar setup to what you want to do.

I've never used algae filters of any kind.

Build Thread - Big E Rimless 80g Sps

6-8" is a good sweet spot range. I'd go 8" and see how colors/growth respond.........this will give you better coverage. If acros are shutting down or dying you need to look at other causes as I doubt it's the lights. I’ll try messing with them and see if I have any better luck. I’ve done...

www.reef2reef.com

Here's a basic rundown of my current 150g---
2% daily water change = 10% a week........ I do do 10% weekly on my separate 60g frag tank.
Large oversized skimmer
ESV B-Ionic- This is the only thing I dose.
No coral foods, just homemade mush for the fish.

I don't chase ph

Best advice........don't follow the hyped fads, most are regurgitated things we have done in the past.

 

[DanyL]

I mean, everyone has their own definition of what they call “simple”.

For me it’s using balling with Sodium Hydroxide because the frag tank is in a bed room with extremely low PH and taking care of kalk is more work.

I also use old water from changing water in my main system, because I’m lazy, and it works perfectly fine for me over a year and half now.

You’ll also want to dose traces, I tried the other route and once you have decent consumption it becomes quite evident.

I also don’t keep many fish, but a lot of corals and use an oversized skimmer - because for me it’s far easier to always have them bottom out (in their natural condition) so that I can control them by dosing, than to try to lower them just enough and keep them stable otherwise.


But yeah, at this point you do have a fully blown system.. so is it simple? Only you can tell.

If you want a really simple system, you can also keep a fishless small tank, no dosing, no skimmers, no rocks, only coral, light, small power head, temp control and a bit of carbon with daily 10% WC with old water from main system - that’s my coral QT system which can keep acros no problem.

 

[spartanman22]

This tank was an AIO. Packed all the chambers with ceramic media, ran a Tunze nano skimmer. Dosed 3 part with a GHL. About as simple of a setup as I’ve ever run.

 

[Gumbies R Us]

This tank was an AIO. Packed all the chambers with ceramic media, ran a Tunze nano skimmer. Dosed 3 part with a GHL. About as simple of a setup as I’ve ever run.

Your acros look great!

 

[NickHolmes]

I don't mean to sound like an All-for-Reef fanboy but so far its working out well for my lazy/forgetful nature. I still haven't gotten around to connecting my doser since we moved in December 2023 so I manually dose about 50ml once a day after I feed the fish. Tank is 80g.

I've only done 3 or 4 water changes in 1.5 years. Did I mention I'm lazy?

Cost wise the powder form is good value and it doesn't seem to affect the pH. Nutrients are always high which I've tried to tackle in the past with carbon dosing and lanthanum but the tank just seems happier at these levels -
Nitrates: 40-50
Po4: 0.15

 

[Gumbies R Us]

I don't mean to sound like an All-for-Reef fanboy but so far its working out well for my lazy/forgetful nature. I still haven't gotten around to connecting my doser since we moved in December 2023 so I manually dose about 50ml once a day after I feed the fish. Tank is 80g.

I've only done 3 or 4 water changes in 1.5 years. Did I mention I'm lazy?

Cost wise the powder form is good value and it doesn't seem to affect the pH. Nutrients are always high which I've tried to tackle in the past with carbon dosing and lanthanum but the tank just seems happier at these levels -
Nitrates: 40-50
Po4: 0.15

I use All For Reef for my tank!

 

[GARRIGA]

No experience with SPS but simple to me means turning that sump to a full blown Fuge, no socks, no skimmers and AFR. Removing the skimmer means higher water level therefore full use of sump to grow enough Chaeto to solve nutrients including phosphates and nitrates and less frequent water changes since dilution solved by plants doing their thing naturally plus larger overall water volume improves dilution and stability should something go wrong. Export of nutrients solved by tossing excess Chaeto. This also solves gas exchange previously provided by skimmer and lights pegged to pH solves excess co2. Periodic ICP to supplement trace provided by AFR. Due to use of Chaeto, sump can have a lid reducing evaporation and same can be done to main meaning less RODI needed. Ran a fish room that when lids added my water top off dropped off 95% plus. Can't stress how beneficial it is to not have mold build up for those of us in high humidity locations. Plus AFR more potent than Kalk therefore less evaporation needed to dose that one single juice.

Nutrient stripping can be solved by overfeeding or dosing ammonium direct which science indicates what all plant like life prefers. Corals contain plant like life. Nitrates not their preferred choice.

Route I'm taking because simple my approach to everything and high home co2 will otherwise prevent keeping Sticks. End of day. Water management the juice. Nothing magical about that and lots have success in many ways yet all seem to have one central theme. Proper water management plus proper PAR. Any feel free to prove me wrong

 

[PotatoPig]

My comments about 4 months into SPS with no losses and all corals growing and encrusting:

1. Not all SPS are equal difficulty. I’d suggest starting out with corals that have been in aquariums and aquaculture for a long time, these tend to be hardier, grow well in aquariums, and as a bonus are generally cheap because they grow so much better than some more sensitive variants. This goes for pretty much all SPS types, including Acros.

2. If you haven’t already, find a PAR meter and confirm what you actually have in your tank.

3. IMO microbiome is the secret sauce, not copepods but bacteria and viruses and so on that your tank is teeming with and form a significant portion of the biological activity going on in the tank. This can be provided via live rock and critters - snails, etc. unfortunately there’s no real test for this…

4. IMO when looking at frags “actively encrusting the plug” is a better guide for health of the frag than “somewhat bigger”.

5. Good beginner SPS are often montis, digis, stylos, and birds nest - especially varieties in aquaculture. Some folks reckon a few of these are problematically easy - eg the red monti you should be able to find cheaply almost anywhere as it can require effort to keep contained once it gets going.

 

[Barrnone]

I've been keeping acros for 24 years and have a similar setup to what you want to do.

I've never used algae filters of any kind.

Build Thread - Big E Rimless 80g Sps

6-8" is a good sweet spot range. I'd go 8" and see how colors/growth respond.........this will give you better coverage. If acros are shutting down or dying you need to look at other causes as I doubt it's the lights. I’ll try messing with them and see if I have any better luck. I’ve done...

www.reef2reef.com

Here's a basic rundown of my current 150g---
2% daily water change = 10% a week........ I do do 10% weekly on my separate 60g frag tank.
Large oversized skimmer
ESV B-Ionic- This is the only thing I dose.
No coral foods, just homemade mush for the fish.

I don't chase ph

Best advice........don't follow the hyped fads, most are regurgitated things we have done in the past.

Are your daily water changes automated? What you currently do sounds similar to what I want to try in my new tank.

 

[ClownSchool]

I've been keeping acros for 24 years and have a similar setup to what you want to do.

I've never used algae filters of any kind.

Build Thread - Big E Rimless 80g Sps

6-8" is a good sweet spot range. I'd go 8" and see how colors/growth respond.........this will give you better coverage. If acros are shutting down or dying you need to look at other causes as I doubt it's the lights. I’ll try messing with them and see if I have any better luck. I’ve done...

www.reef2reef.com

Here's a basic rundown of my current 150g---
2% daily water change = 10% a week........ I do do 10% weekly on my separate 60g frag tank.
Large oversized skimmer
ESV B-Ionic- This is the only thing I dose.
No coral foods, just homemade mush for the fish.

I don't chase ph

Best advice........don't follow the hyped fads, most are regurgitated things we have done in the past.

Sounds great! If you add a squirt of phyto, you just explained my system.
I’m on my second year and the biggest issue I have is leaving for vacations and letting my daughter fish-sit.
I usually come home to salinity and nutrient spikes that take weeks to correct, and there’s often some stalled growth and visual coral stress, but otherwise I’ve had great results.

 

[billyocean]

You can always add equipment as you see fit. Dosers for alk and calcium and socks and rocks. Added a skimmer about 2 months ago as I'm trying something that I think requires it. As far as GAC...no need to run it 24/7 unless you have leathers or something in there.

 

[Toob]

No experience with SPS but simple to me means turning that sump to a full blown Fuge, no socks, no skimmers and AFR. Removing the skimmer means higher water level therefore full use of sump to grow enough Chaeto to solve nutrients including phosphates and nitrates and less frequent water changes since dilution solved by plants doing their thing naturally plus larger overall water volume improves dilution and stability should something go wrong. Export of nutrients solved by tossing excess Chaeto. This also solves gas exchange previously provided by skimmer and lights pegged to pH solves excess co2. Periodic ICP to supplement trace provided by AFR. Due to use of Chaeto, sump can have a lid reducing evaporation and same can be done to main meaning less RODI needed. Ran a fish room that when lids added my water top off dropped off 95% plus. Can't stress how beneficial it is to not have mold build up for those of us in high humidity locations. Plus AFR more potent than Kalk therefore less evaporation needed to dose that one single juice.

Nutrient stripping can be solved by overfeeding or dosing ammonium direct which science indicates what all plant like life prefers. Corals contain plant like life. Nitrates not their preferred choice.

Route I'm taking because simple my approach to everything and high home co2 will otherwise prevent keeping Sticks. End of day. Water management the juice. Nothing magical about that and lots have success in many ways yet all seem to have one central theme. Proper water management plus proper PAR. Any feel free to prove me wrong

This person is looking for people who have simple approaches to keeping SPS and you:

1. Have no experience with SPS
2. Share 3 paragraphs of recommendations that are absolutely not simple in any way



To the OP: most experienced SPS keep pretty simple systems. I dose 2 part and that’s about it (ESV). I don’t run carbon, UV, or any mechanical filtration.

Good light and flow, regular water changes, 2 part, good skimmer. And I feed a lot! That is my simple approach.

My tank:

 

[GARRIGA]

This person is looking for people who have simple approaches to keeping SPS and you:

1. Have no experience with SPS
2. Share 3 paragraphs of recommendations that are absolutely not simple in any way



To the OP: most experienced SPS keep pretty simple systems. I dose 2 part and that’s about it (ESV). I don’t run carbon, UV, or any mechanical filtration.

Good light and flow, regular water changes, 2 part, good skimmer. And I feed a lot! That is my simple approach.

My tank:

Those who put this guy on the moon not only didn’t have SPS but never owned a space ship. Yet they took the science and applied it and got it done.

That aside. What exactly did I say that wouldn’t be successful and post implementation wouldn’t keep reefing simple. Plus how exactly is stripping a sump of socks and skimmer then adding macroalgae complicated. Pretty sure a caveman can accomplish that in an afternoon after club of the month meeting

Have always considered the “you haven’t done it premise” rather small minded since everything ever done once had to be started and all advancements begin with trying something others haven’t

 

[DanyL]

No one said it wouldn’t be successful, evidently - many refers do it and are running successful systems.

But instead of creating a simple system tailored to grow SPS, you add yet another living thing that needs your attention and requires an environment that can support it. This means additional trace elements, extra nutrients, and well.. a big enough sump which may not even exist in an AIO.
Not only that, but on a small, low maintenance system things can happen rather quickly, which can easily crash a refuge, and in turn loosing the only filtration and oxidation in the system.

So I’m not necessarily say it’s a bad an approach, but other approaches seem a lot easier to setup, simple to maintain and long lasting than this.

 

[GARRIGA]

No one said it wouldn’t be successful, evidently - many refers do it and are running successful systems.

But instead of creating a simple system tailored to grow SPS, you add yet another living thing that needs your attention and requires an environment that can support it. This means additional trace elements, extra nutrients, and well.. a big enough sump which may not even exist in an AIO.
Not only that, but on a small, low maintenance system things can happen rather quickly, which can easily crash a refuge, and in turn loosing the only filtration and oxidation in the system.

So I’m not necessarily say it’s a bad an approach, but other approaches seem a lot easier to setup, simple to maintain and long lasting than this.

End of day. We all have our approaches. Last shy should do is knock another's as being a joke because they don’t agree with it.

As for not having enough room in an ATO. I thought we were talking about an actual sump. Were it ATO then HOB can be added assuming room allows it.

Added trace isn’t a concern. All trace should be tested to assess having proper levels. Can’t just rely on water changes which only rebalance that being replaced.

Added complexity of adding a light nullifies the need for a skimmer and throwing grass out easier than cleaning socks or tossing floss in a cup.

This approach has existed before I was born. No different than the planted around in Europe I read about in the 60s. Same concept. Reefers think this they do is new. It’s not.

Don’t have to agree with me as I don’t with you. This is the approach I’ll be taking and something I’ve been experimenting with since 2015 and key being we are managing water. Why people like SPS more complex then that has never made sense to me. All we are going is making the water and light accredits or to that we are keeping. Do you not agree with that or do you feel there’s some special sauce to successful Stick keeping that only a few know and suddenly those best suited to speak of how to manage water?

Algae Power. Simplest way to manage nutrients, maintain alkalinity and scrub co2 that raises pH and contributes oxygen. Kicker. Not just for SPS which more dependent on maintaining certain nutrient levels and PAR and flow. Why we need to mix maintenance with what we keep as if it matters beyond me. I’m just one seeking simplicity even if others don’t agree.

 

[DanyL]

You missed the point why I said “tailored to growing SPS” - it is not because your method wouldn’t, but because it adds an additional living thing one needs to take care of, instead of focusing on what really matters and using what others perceive as a far more stable and simple method to maintain a system.

Opinions will always drive people to be passionate about one thing or another - and there is nothing wrong with it - that’s yours, but one also need to accept different views on said method exists and could be valid just as much as yours.

 

[ClownSchool]

This person is looking for people who have simple approaches to keeping SPS and you:

1. Have no experience with SPS
2. Share 3 paragraphs of recommendations that are absolutely not simple in any way



To the OP: most experienced SPS keep pretty simple systems. I dose 2 part and that’s about it (ESV). I don’t run carbon, UV, or any mechanical filtration.

Good light and flow, regular water changes, 2 part, good skimmer. And I feed a lot! That is my simple approach.

My tank:

I agree. I found running carbon stripped nutrients the corals want and slow growth.