Tough Red Bristle Alge

Naso180 · Jan 8, 2020

Help! I have the stuff in the picture I attached here. Gelidiopsis seems to be the closest species to it i can find mentioned anywhere, but I don;t think that's what this stuff is. I have not yet found what eats it or how to control it. It's in a flat with Yellow Tangs, a Tomini Tang, a Powder Brown Tang, a Fox Face, many Emerald Crabs, blue leg hermits, Mexican Turbo Snails, and Turban (Tectus fenestratus) snails. I tried several different species of urchins, but they avoid it in favor of the coralline algae and can't get into the nooks and crannies. Other info: I used Vibrant for a few months in this system at the higher off-label dose they recommend and it took care of all the algae in the system except this one, essentially selecting this one for success

. I have since added some hair algae and a green film algae to the system to try to compete with it, but that isn't slowing it down at all. My Tangs keep them in check, but not this one.

I'm open to suggestions - Other types of herbivores (reef safe fish or inverts, even Asternia Stars if they'll eat it), Hydrogen Peroxide which does kill it when applied in off the shelf 3% concentration for 60-90 seconds, but is also hard on the corals, and I can't wash the whole system with Peroxide can I? I'm Open to lighting color/intensity and period changes as well. It doesn't grow in the dimmer parts of the flat, but I'm not sure if my SPS can survive on the low light level it will take to kill this stuff. Could this be as simple as reducing PUR?

This needs to be a high nutrient system for coral growth and health, and i do monitor my nitrate/Phosphate balance so there are both present. I appreciate any help anybody can provide!

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AllSignsPointToFish · Jan 8, 2020

How much nitrate and phosphate do you have?

Naso180 · Jan 8, 2020

AllSignsPointToFish said:
How much nitrate and phosphate do you have?

Nitrate = 1.0 ppm - Red Sea test kit
Phosphate = .08 ppm - Hanna Checker - I started dosing NeoPhos to get this up from 0, Nitrates are occurring naturally from feeding fish with an auto feeder. This feeding also includes Reef Roids and BRS Reef Chili mixed with flake.

AllSignsPointToFish · Jan 8, 2020

That's not really a high nutrients load. In fact, it's on the lower end. Have you tried a sea hare?

Naso180 · Jan 8, 2020

I haven't tried a sea hare. I always thought they were better for softer algae. This stuff is bristly and calcerous which is why I think the Tangs and Turbo Snails don't like it. I'm also afraid of adding a sea hare because of the power heads I have in the flat. Don't want to nuke the tank if it gets shreaded or dies.

AllSignsPointToFish · Jan 8, 2020

I don't know if there are any easy answers. Do you have a foxface?

Naso180 · Jan 8, 2020

AllSignsPointToFish said:
I don't know if there are any easy answers. Do you have a foxface?

I do and it is not interested in this stuff. I've tried the easy stuff already and is why I posted here. Most reefers I show this stuff to have never seen it before or it has not been an issue for them - lucky me haha. Any other ideas? I'm wondering about hermit crabs? Blue legs don't seem to be effective, but are there other species that might be more aggressive about eating it?

vetteguy53081 · Jan 8, 2020

Really no invert will deal with this. I have had to pull mine little by little by hand. This stuff is like a brillo pad.
Fluxonasal and peroxide should help loosen as it is a form of red hair algae

Naso180 · Jan 9, 2020

vetteguy53081 said:
Really no invert will deal with this. I have had to pull mine little by little by hand. This stuff is like a brillo pad.
Fluxonasal and peroxide should help loosen as it is a form of red hair algae

Thank you for the reply. I scrape, tweeze and toothbrush this stuff off. I have also been able to use peroxide where the corals can tolerate it. It does kill it. Most LPS can handle the Peroxide, but most SPS don't tolerate it well.

I also just dialed my Kessil lights back 10% while keeping the period the same. I'll see if this helps knock it back a bit and is still enough for my SPS.

zzl630 · Feb 8, 2020

Following. I have the exactly same algae spreads out everywhere. Non of the tang or invert eats it. It competes space with sps too and sps always lose it. Manually pull it then the small branches gets spread out again.

Naso180 · Feb 8, 2020

zzl630 said:
Following. I have the exactly same algae spreads out everywhere. Non of the tang or invert eats it. It competes space with sps too and sps always lose it. Manually pull it then the small branches gets spread out again.

Yup. That's the stuff. Just curious what temperature range you have in that tank. I have two systems and this stuff is in both of them, but in one it is almost undetectable. In fact I added a frag with some on it from the system it dominates to the other system and in a week it was gone. Similar parameters in both systems as far as light, PH, nutrients, predators... The only difference I could see is that the system it is everywhere has a temperature range of 73.6 - 75.5 and the system it doesn't grow in is 77 - 78.3. Temp is one thing, the other is that I used Vibrant at high does for a couple of months in the system it dominates. It's possible that there are some cultures of bacteria still in that system that keep other algae that would grow over it from growing in that system. So two questions - 1. Did you use Vibrant? 2. What temperature range is your tank?

zzl630 · Feb 8, 2020

I tried Vibrant for 1 small dose about 2 ml and two sps frags rtn. After that I haven't tried it yet.
my temp is between 78-80.

It appears to me KZ sponge power encourages its growth a lot. But it could be coincident.

It doesn't look like other types of algae. Its more like a brittle coralline algae with intense structure. I believe it came with one of the frags I bought. It looks cool first then become an outbreak nightmare.

Naso180 · Feb 8, 2020

zzl630 said:
I tried Vibrant for 1 small dose about 2 ml and two sps frags rtn. After that I haven't tried it yet.
my temp is between 78-80.

It appears to me KZ sponge power encourages its growth a lot. But it could be coincident.

It doesn't look like other types of algae. Its more like a brittle coraline algae with intense structure. I believe it came with one of the frags I bought. It looks cool first then become an outbreak nightmare.

I agree that it is more like a coraline algae or a Halmeda in that it is really calcareous. I'm only feeding flake, Nori, and Reef Roids in this tank, so I'm not sure about the Sponge Power.

One other difference between my systems is that the one it thrives in has lower Nitrate levels than the one it doesn't survive in. The system it's in averages about .25ppm NO3 and .1 PPM PO4 and the system it is not in is 1.00ppm NO3 and .3ppm PO4or a bit more at times. This ratio is more "normal" where NO3 is way higher than PO4. I think higher PO4 and low NO3 may be giving this stuff an edge over other algae that would grow over it or out compete it. Maybe all I need to do I dose Nitrogen/NO3. I'm curious what your levels are.

zzl630 · Feb 9, 2020

Naso180 said:
I agree that it is more like a coraline algae or a Halmeda in that it is really calcareous. I'm only feeding flake, Nori, and Reef Roids in this tank, so I'm not sure about the Sponge Power.

One other difference between my systems is that the one it thrives in has lower Nitrate levels than the one it doesn't survive in. The system it's in averages about .25ppm NO3 and .1 PPM PO4 and the system it is not in is 1.00ppm NO3 and .3ppm PO4or a bit more at times. This ratio is more "normal" where NO3 is way higher than PO4. I think higher PO4 and low NO3 may be giving this stuff an edge over other algae that would grow over it or out compete it. Maybe all I need to do I dose Nitrogen/NO3. I'm curious what your levels are.

12 ppm NO3
0.15 PPM PO4

just pulled a bunch of them yesterday. Trapped so much ditritus.

Naso180 · Feb 9, 2020

zzl630 said:
12 ppm NO3
0.15 PPM PO4

just pulled a bunch of them yesterday. Trapped so much ditritus.

It does trap detritus, but I have lots of pods living in it too. I have pulled some frags and rocks out and treated with Hydrogen Peroxide 3% and the pods come streaming out. The H2O2 does kill it, but I just can't treat everything all at the same time to totally eliminate it.

Your numbers and temperature range blow my theories about what has allowed this stuff grow in one system and not the other. I just need to find what's different about my two systems.... I've spoken to some very experienced reefers about it and no one has ever run into it. One who owns a maintenance company and reef shop in particular. Very strange.

I'm thinking about putting a rock in my display for a month and letting it load up with the flora and fauna from my tank without it and transplanting it to my flat. My display is healthy and has no pests, but maybe it has a better balance of bacteria and algae

The flat with this stuff has almost no green algae in it. Just this stuff and coraline algae. Does your tank also have some green algae or only this stuff?

Naso180 · Feb 9, 2020

Naso180 said:
It does trap detritus, but I have lots of pods living in it too. I have pulled some frags and rocks out and treated with Hydrogen Peroxide 3% and the pods come streaming out. The H2O2 does kill it, but I just can't treat everything all at the same time to totally eliminate it.

Your numbers and temperature range blow my theories about what has allowed this stuff grow in one system and not the other. I just need to find what's different about my two systems.... I've spoken to some very experienced reefers about it and no one has ever run into it. One who owns a maintenance company and reef shop in particular. Very strange.

I'm thinking about putting a rock in my display for a month and letting it load up with the flora and fauna from my tank without it and transplanting it to my flat. My display is healthy and has no pests, but maybe it has a better balance of bacteria and algae

The flat with this stuff has almost no green algae in it. Just this stuff and coraline algae. Does your tank also have some green algae or only this stuff?

One other thought... What is your cuc like? Do you have turbo snails or other snails that might be really good at eating other algae? I have big Mexican Turbos that eat everything but this stuff.

zzl630 · Feb 9, 2020

I have a few turbo and other snails. Also have 3 urchins. They all prefer other algae and coralline algae. I have some turf algae and hair algae. Massive amount of coralline.
do they grow in your low light or no light area?

zzl630 · Feb 9, 2020

I read somewhere tropic abalone may eat it. Just need to find who has it for sale

Naso180 · Feb 9, 2020

zzl630 said:
I have a few turbo and other snails. Also have 3 urchins. They all prefer other algae and coralline algae. I have some turf algae and hair algae. Massive amount of coralline.
do they grow in your low light or no light area?

It does not grow in lower light areas. In my display tank I only find it just above the waterline in some corners. I had urchins too thinking they would eat this tough stuff, but they mostly just ate the coralline. They carried all my frags around so I traded them back to my lfs. I tried Pencil Urchins too because they can't pick things up and carry them, but they aren't very active and none of the urchins could get near to the bases of the corals or small spaces to eat it. I never saw them eat it anyway. I have a very small amount of green film algae, but not much. I have tried to plant hair algae in there from my display, but no luck. In my display the tangs keep it mowed short and I even have bare rock, but in the fuge there is some hair algae in a couple places where the chaeto and grape macro algae aren't. I just put some more in the flat to see if it will just grow faster than the pink stuff and maybe cover it.

My thought about the turbo snails is that they are eating everything else before it has a chance to get established, essentially eliminating this stuff's competition. In my display, the other algaes are either growing over it so quickly that it can't get going or there is enough to entice the tangs to graze close enough to this stuff to break it up even if they don't eat it.

I have my doubts about the abalone, but If I could get my hands on one, i'd try it. If you get one, let me know how it does.

zzl630 · Mar 22, 2020

@Naso180 Hey bud, I bought a bunch of Astraea Turbo Snail from Liveaquaria, I think they are the ones attacking these tough algae. Do you have Astraea snail in your tank?