Recommendations for Dosing Pump Model for Robotank

[mjreefs]

Hi everyone,

So I'm waiting for me to receive my Robotank within the next few weeks. I plan to buy some Kamoer peristaltic pumps to hopefully create a doser. I'll be asking my friend to 3D print the housing. I'm just confused with the tons of options of pumps from Kamoer. I plan to do 2 part and Kalkwasser, and maybe my ATO once my current one breaks down. Any recommendations on which model of the pump to get? Thank you!

 

[Ranjib]

I use the cheapest 15$ 12v dc pumps from kamoer,


Low flow peristaltic pump 12V dc Kamoer NKP DIY liquid small dosing pump for aquarium lab analytical 3mm ID x 5mm OD https://a.co/d/0XMobKX

 

[Wolfw28]

Hi everyone,

So I'm waiting for me to receive my Robotank within the next few weeks. I plan to buy some Kamoer peristaltic pumps to hopefully create a doser. I'll be asking my friend to 3D print the housing. I'm just confused with the tons of options of pumps from Kamoer. I plan to do 2 part and Kalkwasser, and maybe my ATO once my current one breaks down. Any recommendations on which model of the pump to get? Thank you!

1.stepper motor pump are going to be slightly more accurate and consistent in dosing amount or regular brush pumps personally I use the regular brush style pump with no problems.
2. Flow rate of the pump is very important based on your dosing amount. The small the dosing amount the slower the flow rate. Flow rates are basically done in ml per minute. For example my 20gal nano get 3ml of RedSea foundation B a day. Reefpi is setup to run for 5sec at 100%. So you need to match your flow rate with your dosing needs.

 

[PeterEde]

Kamoer x5s is what I bought.
Easiest option. Just need to calibrate

 

[mjreefs]

I use the cheapest 15$ 12v dc pumps from kamoer,


Low flow peristaltic pump 12V dc Kamoer NKP DIY liquid small dosing pump for aquarium lab analytical 3mm ID x 5mm OD https://a.co/d/0XMobKX

Thanks for this @Ranjib!

I'm curious how you calibrate and control the dosing pump for Reef-Pi? Since the pump runs at a constant or near-constant speed, do you just adjust the time it runs to get the amount you would need? Also, how often do you find yourself needing to calibrate the NKP pumps?

1.stepper motor pump are going to be slightly more accurate and consistent in dosing amount or regular brush pumps personally I use the regular brush style pump with no problems.
2. Flow rate of the pump is very important based on your dosing amount. The small the dosing amount the slower the flow rate. Flow rates are basically done in ml per minute. For example my 20gal nano get 3ml of RedSea foundation B a day. Reefpi is setup to run for 5sec at 100%. So you need to match your flow rate with your dosing needs.

Any particular model of the Kamoer pumps you would recommend?

Kamoer x5s is what I bought.
Easiest option. Just need to calibrate

Sorry, but I'm just looking for the pumps and not a fully-functional doser. I already have a Robo-tank incoming and wouldn't need such an expensive piece of equipment. I can just buy the pumps and hoses then hook them up through the Reef-Pi and ask my friend to 3D print the housing for the pumps. It may be the easiest, but it will be the costliest and most redundant option.

 

[Sral]

Thanks for this @Ranjib!

I'm curious how you calibrate and control the dosing pump for Reef-Pi? Since the pump runs at a constant or near-constant speed, do you just adjust the time it runs to get the amount you would need? Also, how often do you find yourself needing to calibrate the NKP pumps?
(...)

You can adjust the speed of the pumps using PWM duty cycle (Pulse-Width-Modulation).
Calibration procedure was explained a bit in the Adafruit Guide. Basically: set a PWM duty cycle, set a duration and see how much volume that pumps. Then adjust the time to get the desired volume.

Personally I think there should be something of an an accuracy maximum when pumping in the range of dozens of seconds (maybe 10-60 sec ?). Too short and the timing of the PI (if there is any) might result in inaccuracy, too long and pump wear and tear might cause too much drift in the long run.

Can't speak of any experience with the pumps yet, but personally I would test once a month and double the spacing every time the calibration shows no change.

 

[Wolfw28]

Thanks for this @Ranjib!

I'm curious how you calibrate and control the dosing pump for Reef-Pi? Since the pump runs at a constant or near-constant speed, do you just adjust the time it runs to get the amount you would need? Also, how often do you find yourself needing to calibrate the NKP pumps?



Any particular model of the Kamoer pumps you would recommend?


Sorry, but I'm just looking for the pumps and not a fully-functional doser. I already have a Robo-tank incoming and wouldn't need such an expensive piece of equipment. I can just buy the pumps and hoses then hook them up through the Reef-Pi and ask my friend to 3D print the housing for the pumps. It may be the easiest, but it will be the costliest and most redundant option.

You adjust the speed of the pump and the amount of time on mine to dose 3ml my pump runs at 100% (12v) for 5sec.

 

[Wolfw28]

Thanks for this @Ranjib!

I'm curious how you calibrate and control the dosing pump for Reef-Pi? Since the pump runs at a constant or near-constant speed, do you just adjust the time it runs to get the amount you would need? Also, how often do you find yourself needing to calibrate the NKP pumps?



Any particular model of the Kamoer pumps you would recommend?


Sorry, but I'm just looking for the pumps and not a fully-functional doser. I already have a Robo-tank incoming and wouldn't need such an expensive piece of equipment. I can just buy the pumps and hoses then hook them up through the Reef-Pi and ask my friend to 3D print the housing for the pumps. It may be the easiest, but it will be the costliest and most redundant option.

 

[mjreefs]

You can adjust the speed of the pumps using PWM duty cycle (Pulse-Width-Modulation).
Calibration procedure was explained a bit in the Adafruit Guide. Basically: set a PWM duty cycle, set a duration and see how much volume that pumps. Then adjust the time to get the desired volume.

Personally I think there should be something of an an accuracy maximum when pumping in the range of dozens of seconds (maybe 10-60 sec ?). Too short and the timing of the PI (if there is any) might result in inaccuracy, too long and pump wear and tear might cause too much drift in the long run.

Can't speak of any experience with the pumps yet, but personally I would test once a month and double the spacing every time the calibration shows no change.

You adjust the speed of the pump and the amount of time on mine to dose 3ml my pump runs at 100% (12v) for 5sec.

View attachment 2814973

So I just checked, I think only the brushless motor ones have PWM while the others don't.

So I assume that the speed can only be adjusted if you use those with PWM. If you're not using any of the PWM ones, you have to just set the time for it to run to get the amount you would need. Am I right with this?

Thanks!

 

[Sral]

So I just checked, I think only the brushless motor ones have PWM while the others don't.

So I assume that the speed can only be adjusted if you use those with PWM. If you're not using any of the PWM ones, you have to just set the time for it to run to get the amount you would need. Am I right with this?

Thanks!

Depends on your setup. I have forgot to mention that I was speaking about the Doser setup from the Adafruit guide.
There the motor current is supplied through a transistor IC, enabling you to PWM the supply current. That works fine with DC brushed motors.

Brushless motors require more complex (and expensive) input by default I think, so you typically get a PWM control for "free".

In Robotank you get PWM control depending on your input Voltage, as explained in the DC extension Manual.
So you might be able to use DC pumps and PWM them down. @robsworld78 : are those DC ports protected by kickback-diodes or are they smoothed to DC by a low-pass filter aka parallel capacitor ?

 

[Wolfw28]

So I just checked, I think only the brushless motor ones have PWM while the others don't.

So I assume that the speed can only be adjusted if you use those with PWM. If you're not using any of the PWM ones, you have to just set the time for it to run to get the amount you would need. Am I right with this?

Thanks!

Here’s the deal I don’t know what all you bought as fare as your Robo-tank setup. So hear is the rundown for the 2 DC modules.
1. Equipment Extension Details/ lighting control module
You would connect your dosing pumps to one of the 12v- 24 v DC pork and configure the in Reefpi as a Jack this will allow Reefpi dosing feature to vary the out put voltage from 0-12v witch would allow you to adjust the speed. The 8 auxiliary port are PWM out put but they are low amperage not enough to to power a dosing pump. They are designed to control this like light or other devices as a control input, for example Kessil light have a 0-10v input to control the dimmer control to very the light intensity. Some pump manufacturers have a 0-10v input to allow you to control the speed of the pump
6, 12v - 24v DC ports
6 emergency backup ports for DC ports
8 auxiliary ports that can be independently
switched between 0-5v PWM, 0-10v PWM,
05v Analog or 0-10v Analog signals

2. Reef-pi Extension - 6 DC Ports + 2 Sensor Ports​

Work , setup , and function the same way as the 6 12-24v port
Check this out for more information it a link to the Robo-Tank website for manuals for Robo-Tank and Reefpi including how to install reefpi https://www.robo-tank.ca/reef-pi_Related_User_Manuals The Reefpi manual is a little older but it’s the best resource I have been able to find. @robsworld78 did and awesome job putting it together. If you have any specific questions on Robo-Tank tag @robsworld78 in your question he’s the owner of Robo-Tank. Hope this helps. Also I don’t use the brand pump you are talking about I useINTLLAB 12V DC DIY Peristaltic Liquid Pump Dosing Pump for Aquarium Lab Analytical 2mm ID x 4mm OD https://a.co/d/5aad1HP

 

[robsworld78]

So I just checked, I think only the brushless motor ones have PWM while the others don't.

So I assume that the speed can only be adjusted if you use those with PWM. If you're not using any of the PWM ones, you have to just set the time for it to run to get the amount you would need. Am I right with this?

Thanks!

Any 12v - 24v pump (depending on the equipment extension input voltage) will work and you'll have some control over the speed. The DC ports can be controlled from reef-pi using the light or dosing tabs. When you slow a port down the voltage drops, the range on 12v is about 6v - 12v. I have some cheap 12v pumps they slow down to maybe half the speed. Some DC motors don't like going under 9v but that still slows them down quite a bit. Here's one of my award winning videos showing them run.

Depends on your setup. I have forgot to mention that I was speaking about the Doser setup from the Adafruit guide.
There the motor current is supplied through a transistor IC, enabling you to PWM the supply current. That works fine with DC brushed motors.

Brushless motors require more complex (and expensive) input by default I think, so you typically get a PWM control for "free".

In Robotank you get PWM control depending on your input Voltage, as explained in the DC extension Manual.
So you might be able to use DC pumps and PWM them down. @robsworld78 : are those DC ports protected by kickback-diodes or are they smoothed to DC by a low-pass filter aka parallel capacitor ?

Yeah they have large kickback diodes and TVS diodes on the gate and source/drain for ESD protection, only no reverse polarity protection as for higher currents it requires lots of parts with 6 ports. With that said the main power input does have reverse polarity protection though using P-mosfet so there's no voltage drop.

Here’s the deal I don’t know what all you bought as fare as your Robo-tank setup. So hear is the rundown for the 2 DC modules.
1. Equipment Extension Details/ lighting control module
You would connect your dosing pumps to one of the 12v- 24 v DC pork and configure the in Reefpi as a Jack this will allow Reefpi dosing feature to vary the out put voltage from 0-12v witch would allow you to adjust the speed. The 8 auxiliary port are PWM out put but they are low amperage not enough to to power a dosing pump. They are designed to control this like light or other devices as a control input, for example Kessil light have a 0-10v input to control the dimmer control to very the light intensity. Some pump manufacturers have a 0-10v input to allow you to control the speed of the pump
6, 12v - 24v DC ports
6 emergency backup ports for DC ports
8 auxiliary ports that can be independently
switched between 0-5v PWM, 0-10v PWM,
05v Analog or 0-10v Analog signals

2. Reef-pi Extension - 6 DC Ports + 2 Sensor Ports​

Work , setup , and function the same way as the 6 12-24v port
Check this out for more information it a link to the Robo-Tank website for manuals for Robo-Tank and Reefpi including how to install reefpi https://www.robo-tank.ca/reef-pi_Related_User_Manuals The Reefpi manual is a little older but it’s the best resource I have been able to find. @robsworld78 did and awesome job putting it together. If you have any specific questions on Robo-Tank tag @robsworld78 in your question he’s the owner of Robo-Tank. Hope this helps. Also I don’t use the brand pump you are talking about I useINTLLAB 12V DC DIY Peristaltic Liquid Pump Dosing Pump for Aquarium Lab Analytical 2mm ID x 4mm OD https://a.co/d/5aad1HP

Good explanation however the Dc port output will only range from about 6v - 12v.

 

[Wolfw28]

Any 12v - 24v pump (depending on the equipment extension input voltage) will work and you'll have some control over the speed. The DC ports can be controlled from reef-pi using the light or dosing tabs. When you slow a port down the voltage drops, the range on 12v is about 6v - 12v. I have some cheap 12v pumps they slow down to maybe half the speed. Some DC motors don't like going under 9v but that still slows them down quite a bit. Here's one of my award winning videos showing them run.




Yeah they have large kickback diodes and TVS diodes on the gate and source/drain for ESD protection, only no reverse polarity protection as for higher currents it requires lots of parts with 6 ports. With that said the main power input does have reverse polarity protection though using P-mosfet so there's no voltage drop.


Good explanation however the Dc port output will only range from about 6v - 12v.

@robsworld78 technically we are both right. When it’s off it 0v

 

[Sral]

(...) Here's one of my award winning videos showing them run. (...)

Great ! Some low cost video/exlpanation is much better than non at all in my opinion ^^