Questions on Dr. Tim's One and Only cycle

[Scottrshoe]

Greetings all. New to the saltwater hobby, and am 2 weeks into cycling my first tank. It is a 20G IM Nuvo 20 set up with CaribSea Life rock and CaribSea Ocean Direct live sand.

I started the cycle with a bottle of Dr. Tim's One and Only and used ammonium chloride drops for the ammonia source, which I have added twice over the last two weeks.

According to the cycle guide that came with the Dr. Tim's, I should have place fish in the tank three days ago, but my Nitrite readings are still off the chart (API Test kit). Ammonia is undetectable on Salifert test kit, and Nitrate is around 25ppm using Nyos test.

I did a 50% water change and test results were the same. Follow up with another 50% water change the next day, and waited 24Hrs. this rings me to today...

Ammonia still undetectable, Nitrite has come down a little, but still reads high (medium purple) and nitrates have dropped quite a bit to around 5 ppm.

Should I continue doing water changes until the nitrates come back down, or just wait longer? Should I add more NH3?

Thanks in advance,
Scott

 

[brandon429]

your cycle is 100% done a while back, and nitrites no longer factor in reef tank cycling whatsoever, at all, it's newer information than what is disclosed on the instructions you read. Coincidentally, I track threads where folks reactively buy more bottled bacteria in response to nitrite testing, and I'm up to like 500 events on file. I can see how it's beneficial to state that high nitrite stalls a cycle, for sales purposes.


the old rules are a sales trick against consumers. your cycle is 100% done, you cant make the tank safer for fish by waiting longer, failing to tell you that is why the old rules are bad for the hobby, and taking money from unsuspecting folks.


if you want to know nitrite impacts, google and read: nitrite in the reef tank, Randy Holmes-Farley. Its neutral, don't own the test kit. when nitrite reads positive, it specifically does not matter in display tank cycling. Nitrite is the #1 most useless test kit to own in reefing.

 

[brandon429]

the next step choice you have is this: make no fish disease protocol, add in fish, they live fine because the filter is set right up until disease takes them

or, you can read the disease forum stickies, model what Jay recommends, and have a much lower disease loss rate at month 8 than non prep tanks

How to unstick any seemingly stuck cycle

non digital ammonia test kit readings make you think you aren’t cycled when indeed you are if you owned a $200 expensive seneye meter, you’d never be doubting your cycle status, since .01% of the reefing population owns these, we need a way to help the majority understand when they’re cycled...

www.reef2reef.com

that's how cycling really works. Notice this:

32 pages
100% passed cycles
no testing any type (they still post tests, but we show them why their readings do NOT factor into start date assessment)
every entrant gets a specific start date, even if they post before the tank is built

cycles are this exact, this compliant, we don't need any testing there it is right above as proof. your specific start date was this: the first day you added the bottle bac the fish could have been carried fine. You'd still be breaking disease protocol, but thousands of tanks are day 1 with fish, skip cycle tanks because bottle bac is that good even in suspension
(this is tested using digital ammonia testers/seneye/ in multiple Dr. Reef bottle bac study threads)


after about 3-4 days post feeding, the Dr. Tims bac adheres to all surfaces and migrates from suspended work within the water column to covering all surfaces and your tank is immune to 100% water changes whereas before implantation, large water changes will export the suspended dosed bacteria. You could have carried fish on day one, but by waiting a few days/ now two weeks/ you are fully ready to reef and water changes cannot undo the cycle, nothing can undo the cycle until you dry the tank out.


*you do not need to test for ammonia or nitrite ever again in this reef, they can't drift out of spec as params. they stay locked in. If five fish die, that's not ammonia doing it/ammonia rose because fish fish died from disease/ammonia testing can never help you again here.

 

[Dburr1014]

Greetings all. New to the saltwater hobby, and am 2 weeks into cycling my first tank. It is a 20G IM Nuvo 20 set up with CaribSea Life rock and CaribSea Ocean Direct live sand.

I started the cycle with a bottle of Dr. Tim's One and Only and used ammonium chloride drops for the ammonia source, which I have added twice over the last two weeks.

According to the cycle guide that came with the Dr. Tim's, I should have place fish in the tank three days ago, but my Nitrite readings are still off the chart (API Test kit). Ammonia is undetectable on Salifert test kit, and Nitrate is around 25ppm using Nyos test.

I did a 50% water change and test results were the same. Follow up with another 50% water change the next day, and waited 24Hrs. this rings me to today...

Ammonia still undetectable, Nitrite has come down a little, but still reads high (medium purple) and nitrates have dropped quite a bit to around 5 ppm.

Should I continue doing water changes until the nitrates come back down, or just wait longer? Should I add more NH3?

Thanks in advance,
Scott

View attachment 2779477

+1 your done. Add fish slowly.
Happy reefing!

 

[Scottrshoe]

Thank you for the prompt response, and for the information! I will definitely check it out!

 

[brandon429]

One last thing so it doesn't appear to readers we just think any submerged item is automatically perma cycled

Surface area


If this was a quarantine tank discussion we'd be discussing seachem alert badges or seneye as helpful water change guides. Absolutely test for and react to rising ammonia, qt run low on surface area, they often struggle

By all means: test for and react to nitrite in -low salinity- observation or holding systems

But for a post- cycle date display reef, at the chloride/ salt levels we run, nitrite and ammonia testing can't help you here they're permanently in control as long as that much surface area remains in your reef. That much rock will carry more bioload than disease outbreaks would allow you to carry.

Randy's article describes the protection chemistry behind our high salt levels in display reefs.

The nitrite/ low salinity issue comes also from Randy's article. No display reef ever runs a low salinity, they don't.

 

[Scottrshoe]

Thanks again for all the great info and advise!

This 20G tank sits on my desk at home, and will become my QT If (when) I pull the trigger on a bigger display tank.

 

[Jekyl]

Welcome to R2R btw!

 

[Scottrshoe]

OK, everyone. I threw caution to the wind... not really...and added a fish today.

I will see how it does before adding anymore.

First inhabitant...the illusive Orchid Dottyback.

Not really what I want to be first, but was on my list for this tank, and the LFS had one. Did not want to risk a $150 pair of clowns yet

Really need a better camera...or at least a filter...lol.

 

[brandon429]

That is perfect start he'll do well

 

[felixx68]

How did this turn out?

 

[brandon429]

I've lost two fish now.

I have lost two fish now, to what I can only assume is parasites. I did not see any outward signs, other than what appeared to be physical trauma and some shredding on the fins. I lost my Orchid Dottyback first, then my bicolor blenny. They both show erratic behavior, and lost of flashing...

www.reef2reef.com

far past cycling, and into disease management for fish. corals stocked into the tank doing well/his zo's post shows

 

[Scottrshoe]

How did this turn out?

Cycle went well. I have had some livestock issues, as stated above. My first fish, the Dottyback above, died, followed closely by my BLenny. I believe the Dottyback had some flukes (or other parasites). I did not quarantine as I should have and thus introduced the other fish into and infected habitat.

I treated with PraziPro, and the lone survivor, Diamond Goby, is doing well.

I have also introduced several corals, and they seem to be doing ok, if not growing especially fast.

Still a learning process on parameter stability, and can't seem to get my nitrates and phosphates up. still running at about 2-4 for N and 0 for P.