Quarantining clownfish

thereefdoctor · Oct 10, 2019

I've seen similar threads out there but I just wanted to be sure I'm up to date with current best practice recommendations for quarantine with an emphasis on clownfish. I'll provide some background info first.

My DT is a RedSea Max Nano that has been cycling for the past 25 days, containing 20-25lb of aquascaped reef saver dry rock and 10lb of caribsea arag-alive fiji pink live sand as well as about a dozen marinepure 2 inch bio blocks in the sump under the protein skimmer. The cycle is going fairly well, have used a couple bottles of Dr Tims one and only and have been dosing their ammonium chloride. So far I think the nitrobacter and other colonies have been slower to multiply, as I have nearly 0 ammonia 24h after dosing 2ppm AC but my nitrites still read in the 2-5 range. Have been dosing every few days when both ammonia and nitrite levels drop below 0.2 per Dr Tims website instructions. No livestock in the DT yet.

My QT is a 10g aqueon LED kit that I got at Petco including a HOB filter (switched out the stock charcoal for filter floss), 100W heater, koralia nano powerhead, PVC and 10 blocks of the marinepure that I took from my DT after a few weeks. Also added a bottle of biospira.

I'm planning on adding two juvenile designer clowns later today from my LFS. They seem like a reputable dealer but I understand that doing a full quarantine on my own would be best practice.

My main question is, what are some of the current medications regimens people recommend for prophylactic dosing? Is the order of medications important (e.g. always do copper last)? Which medications out there can be combined with copper, and is it wise to do so in the setting of prophylaxis where no disease is suspected and time is not a factor?

I understand that some consider chloroquine "gold standard" but I am concerned about the absorptive capabilities of the marinepure blocks and the inability to measure levels of chloroquine after dosing. Getting pure chloroquine would not be difficult for me, but I got myself a Hanna checker for copper and was wanting to try my hand at copper dosing for two weeks at some point during QT. I also have prazipro, API general cure and metroplex on hand. Obviously it would be ideal to use a regimen that has as few medications and steps as possible.

Any help or tips would be much appreciated!!

Doctorgori · Oct 10, 2019

Opinions vary but I’m of the less chemicals the better school of thought .... any chance you can stock all at once ...all the fish anyway?

Marco S · Oct 10, 2019

I always put fish in the QT for a few days to make sure they are eating before starting to dose copper, (unless they have visible signs of ICH or Marine Velvet). Once eating, I start to dose CopperPower slowly to get to therapeutic levels over 3-5 days depending on the fish, (tolerance chart for copper in certain fish is listed as a sticky in the disease Forum).I leave them in copper and feed MetroPlex with Focus for 14 days then move to a clean QT tank, (if you only have one tank then copper for 30 days is required).

In the clean QT I dose PraziPro or API General Cure for 10 more days then large water change and observe for another week or two. I also have larger holding tanks to keep certain fish that I want to add later with other fish in QT if needed, (like Tangs) or for fish I want to add last but bought early because I found a good deal. I also may change the order if I see signs of flukes and dose PraziPro or API General Cure first.

This is just my routine I use following most of what I got from R2R and I have been doing this for almost a year now with pretty good results. I have successfully dealt with ICH, Flukes and Marine Velvet several times as well as bacterial diseases, internal parasites, and brook. That being said, you will most likely loose fish you otherwise would not have, but if you QT everything wet you put in your tank, you will not be bringing anything into your DT, (this includes inverts, coral and even algae). All it takes is failing to QT one piece of coral or invert and you may have just wasted all the time end effert you have put into QT, so it does take a lot of determination and will power not to cheat, but it is worth it in the long run IMO.

Good luck! ;Happy

Edit: Forgot to add...it is very important to keep a separate set of all equipment involved per tank and do not use them for anything else to avoid cross contamination. It is also important to sanitize the tank and all equipment between batches with vinegar or bleach and let dry completely before using again. lastly I keep all QT tanks in separate rooms at least 10 feet away from any other tank due to the chance of transmission through the air, (there is an article on this in the disease section).

BeejReef · Oct 11, 2019

It's a very broad topic.

I like your setup.

You have to decide if you're going to treat prophylactically, or observe and treat for anything that may become apparent.
There are medicines that can not be dosed together. Also, Prime can not be used with copper, so it's good that your system looks fairly well cycled.

Whether it's good to do prophylactic treatment with no signs of disease is heavily debated. The discussion probably centers more around copper than antibiotics. A small tank with lots of medication and stress can kill a healthy fish or cure a sick one.

thereefdoctor · Oct 11, 2019

Doctorgori said:
Opinions vary but I’m of the less chemicals the better school of thought .... any chance you can stock all at once ...all the fish anyway?

The philosophy of close observation over prophylactic dosing is perfectly reasonable, but I don't feel that I have enough (or recent enough) experience with clownfish to be able to tell what are clear vs subtle indicators of different forms of potential disease. My first goal is obviously for the well being of all the living things I plan on eventually adding to my DT but another top priority is minimizing the chance of introducing disease into the system.

Additionally, I think stocking all the fish in QT at once is a bit risky (tempting as it may be) given it's a small tank and ammonia swings would be amplified, though I intend on doing regular water changes and have my RO/DI pumping away as we speak and a brute 30 gallon trashcan mixing tropic marin pro reef salt water.

I only plan on adding max 4 small fish to my DT anyway since it's a 20 gallon system (17.5 in reality when subtracting substrate/rock/equipment by my calculations) so only one more round of fish quarantine should be needed at this stage I feel.

thereefdoctor · Oct 11, 2019

Marco S said:
I always put fish in the QT for a few days to make sure they are eating before starting to dose copper, (unless they have visible signs of ICH or Marine Velvet). Once eating, I start to dose CopperPower slowly to get to therapeutic levels over 3-5 days depending on the fish, (tolerance chart for copper in certain fish is listed as a sticky in the disease Forum).I leave them in copper and feed MetroPlex with Focus for 14 days then move to a clean QT tank, (if you only have one tank then copper for 30 days is required).

In the clean QT I dose PraziPro or API General Cure for 10 more days then large water change and observe for another week or two. I also have larger holding tanks to keep certain fish that I want to add later with other fish in QT if needed, (like Tangs) or for fish I want to add last but bought early because I found a good deal. I also may change the order if I see signs of flukes and dose PraziPro or API General Cure first.

This is just my routine I use following most of what I got from R2R and I have been doing this for almost a year now with pretty good results. I have successfully dealt with ICH, Flukes and Marine Velvet several times as well as bacterial diseases, internal parasites, and brook. That being said, you will most likely loose fish you otherwise would not have, but if you QT everything wet you put in your tank, you will not be bringing anything into your DT, (this includes inverts, coral and even algae). All it takes is failing to QT one piece of coral or invert and you may have just wasted all the time end effert you have put into QT, so it does take a lot of determination and will power not to cheat, but it is worth it in the long run IMO.

Good luck! ;Happy

Edit: Forgot to add...it is very important to keep a separate set of all equipment involved per tank and do not use them for anything else to avoid cross contamination. It is also important to sanitize the tank and all equipment between batches with vinegar or bleach and let dry completely before using again. lastly I keep all QT tanks in separate rooms at least 10 feet away from any other tank due to the chance of transmission through the air, (there is an article on this in the disease section).

Thank you for your thorough response. My QT and DT are 20+ feet apart in different rooms, and I've been careful to prevent cross contamination, have a second set of equipment for my QT needs.

Sadly I don't have the spousal approval to add a third tank to our townhouse to try the tank transfer method. I was not aware that a full month of cupramine would be necessary just for prophylaxis, that seems a bit extreme. As I mentioned I have a Hanna checker for copper and will be testing levels at least daily to ensure therapeutic levels but a whole 30 days?

Also, the people at my LFS (big time coral dealers in LA) are trying to pitch to me that coral quarantine is not truly necessary and that dipping is sufficient but I've read elsewhere that frags could still harbor eggs and other things that a dip may not treat.