Pure White nonphotosynthetic Zoas

[shrimped]

So I just realized that spider sponges are actually composed of two creatures: a Red Tree Sponge and a pure white parasitic nonphotosynthetic Zoanthid. Here is a picture of a “spider sponge” (not mine)

I have a friend @ono_its_sean on insta who works at The Aquarium of the Pacific in the research department who says that this Zoanthid can be taken out of the red sponge and grow independently and be cared for similarly to large polyp nps such as Orange Suncoral and Dendrophylia.
He is unsure if they’re epizoanthus or parazoanthus and how many feedings per day. From me searching around the internet it seems like people have success with a simple 1 - 2 time feeding consisting of reefroids and small meaty foods such as mysis.
This made me curious enough to frag a piece of the white Zoanthids from a red tree sponge in the future and see how it goes. I have never seen anybody do this before so it would be interesting to try. I will update this thread if I ever try this and if someone did experiment with this before please input your experience everybody would love to hear it.

 

[eggplantparrot]

Wow super cool looking. Are the sponges hard to keep alive?

 

[Desmond]

Super cool looking coral

 

[cristata.reef]

Sup Darren, just saw the this whoops. These are likely Epizoanthus and yes they can be removed from the outer surface of the sponge but will need some sort of vertical substrate to maximize their ability to feed on particulate matter from the water column (getting them to attach to the substrate is a completely different matter. These are considered NPS due to the lack of dinoflagellate symbionts so feeding heavily with foods like ReefRoids would be a good idea.

 

[shrimped]

Very old thread but I’ve finally committed into carrying out this experiment. I got an Australian Spider Sponge today and I’m ready to lose the sponge 100%. However I will try to keep it alive through Marine Snow and maybe purchase a bottle of KZ Sponge Power. If it starts to deteriorate, I will separate the white zoas from the red sponge with a razor blade and go from there. I’ll be feeding the zoas with reef roids.

 

[shrimped]

Ok so the zoas we’re opening immediately in high flow. Few inches away from a hygger 1600gph mini wave maker. They were able to eat tdo pellets and reef roids with ease. Will try tropic marin lps pellets tonight. On the fence on purchasing AF Pro-Bio line + Brightwell Blizzard-O + Brightwell Silica + KZ Sponge Power. This is an attempt at keeping the sponge alive or maybe even grow it.

This sponge + zoa relationship is honestly so beautiful. Really wish non photosynthetic sponges are easier to keep.

 

[shrimped]

Oh and Im thinking to take a razor blade to cut a polyp off of the red sponge. Not sure how that would fare.

 

[shrimped]

Update: The epizoanthus took Tropic Marin LPS pellets with ease. I don’t have Hikari Mysis shrimp but I’m pretty sure they could catch those with no problem as well. Not too sure about the Piscine branded Mysis tho. Still great feeding response with broadcast feeding Reef Roids. All polyps close then open once they done eating. Repeat. Keep in mind, I didn’t run any mechanical filtration of any kind. Turned off the UNS Mini Surface skimmer a few days ago. I think the trick so far is high flow, low-no light to discourage algae growth.

After long contemplation, I purchased the following: Aquaforest Pro-Bio F, Pro-Bio S, Pro-Bio NP, Brightwell SpongExcel, and Korallen Zucht Sponge Power. These are for attempting to keep the sponge alive so it doesn’t foul my water chemistry.

The Aquaforest line is also to reduce nitrates & phosphates.

Also got Brightwell PhytoChrom 1-30 micron food and Reef Blizzard-O. These are for the epizoanthus.

Need to monitor Nitrates & Phosphates when i start dosing these. Will be dosed in small amounts first. Then gradually increase depending on Nitrate & Phosphate levels.

 

[shrimped]

Alright so something interesting happened today. This should answer two ongoing questions going around the hobby. Last night Feb/18/2022 I did a 50% water change. Polyps and such were always open and eating heavily before this water change. Didn’t realize that the spider sponge was out of the water in between the water change. Was about 50% out of water roughly 15sec.

Today, the sponge was noticeably shrunk down. Just didn’t look as puffed up as before. Epizoas also not open. First time it being not open. Other sponges I have are doin great. They were also never out of water. Nothing really changed, just added a bit of silicon from KZ Sponge Power, reduced nitrates & phosphate over the past week or two. Added AF Pro-Bio Line as well as more flow.

So pretty much as conclusion, non-inter tidal sponges pretty much completely die when exposed to air, even just a little bit. And no, the epizoanthus will NOT live without the sponge. Their health seems to correlate with the health of the sponge. I wonder exactly why. I have heard that the epizoanthus will grow onto rock work. Granted the sponge was also healthy. Probably due to how the white epizoanthus is all connected, sending nutrients to the epizoanthus that’s not on the sponge. I really don’t know but that’s what I think.

I will monitor the zoas for another day or two but if i don’t see anything happen i’ll just toss the whole thing out. Don’t want to foul the water. This has been a interesting experiment. I now don’t have to think about this in the middle of the night lol.

 

[shrimped]

Oh another thing, after the water change, the zoas were doing fine. Just as usual. Probably took overnight for the sponge to start deteriorating, which led to the zoas to also stop opening.

 

[MartinM]

That’s sad, I hope the sponge recovers. Keep us updated

 

[shrimped]

That’s sad, I hope the sponge recovers. Keep us updated

I highly doubt the sponge would recover. I’ll frag some of the epizoanthus off later today or tomorrow. Yea it’s a bit sad that the white epizoanthus cannot be kept singly without the sponge. But hey, now everyone knows lol.

 

[GigiHayward]

So I just realized that spider sponges are actually composed of two creatures: a Red Tree Sponge and a pure white parasitic nonphotosynthetic Zoanthid. Here is a picture of a “spider sponge” (not mine)View attachment 915480
I have a friend @ono_its_sean on insta who works at The Aquarium of the Pacific in the research department who says that this Zoanthid can be taken out of the red sponge and grow independently and be cared for similarly to large polyp nps such as Orange Suncoral and Dendrophylia.
He is unsure if they’re epizoanthus or parazoanthus and how many feedings per day. From me searching around the internet it seems like people have success with a simple 1 - 2 time feeding consisting of reefroids and small meaty foods such as mysis.
This made me curious enough to frag a piece of the white Zoanthids from a red tree sponge in the future and see how it goes. I have never seen anybody do this before so it would be interesting to try. I will update this thread if I ever try this and if someone did experiment with this before please input your experience everybody would love to hear it.

Is there any chance you think this could be growing on my zoas? I asked the seller I bought from but he seemed pretty evasive and just generally said a sponge but no other information about them or if they're invasive / parasitic or dangerous. You can see little white spike tentacles growing the the zoa stems