New to Reefing - Need advice

[CherryRock]

Hey guys. I am fairly new and wanted to see if I can get some advice on if I am doing things correctly and where to go from here.

Tank is 2 months old. Finished cycling after 2 weeks, and added 2 clowns (Phantom and Misbar), 4 Nassarius snails, and 4 Astrea snails. Unfortunately the Phantom bit the Misbar and caused an infection and we lost him after his bottom jaw disintegrated. We also tried adding a Mandarin Goby and this too died after a day. (Later learned they stress really easily with tank transfers).

Since all of this we have added a DaVinci Clown to keep the Phantom company as well as adding Chaeto to the back of the sump area.

Tank: Innovative Marine 20 gal Peninsula
First sump chamber: floss, carbon, chemi-pure, chaeto (innovative Marine Chaeto light in the back)
Second sump: Eshopps Nano skimmer
Third sump: pump that came with tank
Light: Viparspectra 165w (I know it's not the best, but I bought it before I knew)

Parameters:
Salinity - 1.023
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10
Ph - 8.0
Calcium - 380
Magnesium - 1080
Phosphate - 0.32
Alkalinity - 7.1

- Any thoughts on what to do next? I want to get coral. I really like Hammer, torches, frogspawn, Zoas, Mushrooms, Duncans. I am just worried about the clowns pairing with one and killing it since there is nothing but rock in the tank right now.
- Also want to try a Mandarin again at some point and possibly a Wrasse or sand sifting Goby and shrimp pair

 

[LegalReefer]

Love the mixed sand look! I'd recommend starting with some zoas and mushrooms if you're worried about the clowns killing stuff off. Maybe get a RBTA from someone local if you can, give the clowns something they can actually pair to safely. Start with soft corals and see how that goes, then move your way to the LPS you want, maybe starting with a duncan or hammer. Also, be careful with trying to keep a mandarin, you need a really large and consistent population of 'pods, and I don't think a 20 gallon can easily supply the amount of food they need to survive. Good luck!

 

[dstockwell]

Welcome to the Reef.

Two different clowns may have not been the best way to start. You were no where near ready for a Mandarin, feeding them is the biggest thing and you need a stable system to feed copepods. At 2 months old you really need to slow down and go slower, fast is not good in saltwater.

Should probably wait till 4 months for BTA, have you gone through the ugly phase yet? There is nothing wrong with the light you have, what numbers are you running on it? I have two on a 55 10 inches off the water.

 

[davidcalgary29]

Softies are some of the most beautiful and dynamic corals you can get for your aquarium; don't discount them because they're "easy". You can turn your tank into an alien garden by adding mushrooms, xenia, and Grube's gorgonian. All of these are extremely forgiving and often thrive even in new tanks.

20g is too small, on a long-term basis, for a fairy wrasse. I think your plan for a goby/pistol pair is much better.

 

[CherryRock]

Love the mixed sand look! I'd recommend starting with some zoas and mushrooms if you're worried about the clowns killing stuff off. Maybe get a RBTA from someone local if you can, give the clowns something they can actually pair to safely. Start with soft corals and see how that goes, then move your way to the LPS you want, maybe starting with a duncan or hammer. Also, be careful with trying to keep a mandarin, you need a really large and consistent population of 'pods, and I don't think a 20 gallon can easily supply the amount of food they need to survive. Good luck!

Thanks! I couldn't decide on which sand to get so I figured why not both! It's a learning process.

Appreciate the advice on corals. I defiantly want to pick something that is a little easier to care for and give my tank some more time to mature. Does this mean I need to find a larger or more developed Zoa/Mushroom? Are frags a bad option?

As far as the Mandarin goes, our local fish store said we would be good if we dosed pods in there about every month. It probably was a bad idea at the time, but I went with what the store told me.

 

[CherryRock]

Welcome to the Reef.

Two different clowns may have not been the best way to start. You were no where near ready for a Mandarin, feeding them is the biggest thing and you need a stable system to feed copepods. At 2 months old you really need to slow down and go slower, fast is not good in saltwater.

Should probably wait till 4 months for BTA, have you gone through the ugly phase yet? There is nothing wrong with the light you have, what numbers are you running on it? I have two on a 55 10 inches off the water.

Thank you!

Yes, figured that out the hard way. Our local store said they would be fine together.... guess they really aren't.

They also said the Mandarin would be fine if we dosed with pods every month.

Have not gone through the ugly phase. I was just starting to lose confidence in the local store and wanted some more opinions on what to do next or when would be a good time to add more fish or coral. It seems there are a lot of experienced people here that may help lead me in the right direction.

 

[dstockwell]

About your light what settings are you running, how much blue, white and how high off the water.

 

[CherryRock]

About your light what settings are you running, how much blue, white and how high off the water.

Right now I am running it 8 inches off the water. Blue is set to 15 for 6 or 7 hours and the white is set to 10 for an hour before and an hour after. I am slowly increasing the Blue and White intensity every week. I read somewhere else that someone had theirs set at Blue 35 and White 15 at 8 inches off the water and his corals were happy. I was going to work up to this setting and see.

 

[kevgib67]

I have 2 clowns in a 32 gallon with softies, lps and sps. The clowns ignore my corals and instead gladly except being hosted by my power head. I don’t think you need to worry. There are captive bread mandarins that are sold already eating prepared foods. I believe there are a few such as Biota. You pay more but you’ll have more success than with wild caught that may or may not eat anything but pods.

 

[dstockwell]

These are the PAR numbers on my 55 running two 10 inches off the water 25 Blue and 2 White.

https://www.reef2reef.com/attachments/tank-par-jpg.2778745/

 

[CherryRock]

These are the PAR numbers on my 55 running two 10 inches off the water 25 Blue and 2 White.

https://www.reef2reef.com/attachments/tank-par-jpg.2778745/

Very helpful. Thank you!

 

[CherryRock]

I have 2 clowns in a 32 gallon with softies, lps and sps. The clowns ignore my corals and instead gladly except being hosted by my power head. I don’t think you need to worry. There are captive bread mandarins that are sold already eating prepared foods. I believe there are a few such as Biota. You pay more but you’ll have more success than with wild caught that may or may not eat anything but pods.

Ha! Good to hear. I may try another Mandarin later on or just wait until I get a bigger tank down the road. They really are one of my favorites, but I don't want to starve the fish or make it miserable either.

 

[Kiboshed]

As far as the Mandarin goes, our local fish store said we would be good if we dosed pods in there about every month. It probably was a bad idea at the time, but I went with what the store told me.

Thank you!

Yes, figured that out the hard way. Our local store said they would be fine together.... guess they really aren't.

They also said the Mandarin would be fine if we dosed with pods every month.

I was just starting to lose confidence in the local store and wanted some more opinions on what to do next or when would be a good time to add more fish or coral. It seems there are a lot of experienced people here that may help lead me in the right direction.

Little tip I learned early on is to not take advice from someone with a vested interest in selling you anything.

Even if they are a friend, regardless of the hobby.

 

[Uncle99]

While your fish only, and softies, those numbers fine.
However, if your adding Stoney type corals your numbers gotta change and keeping them absolutely stable, essential.

Salinity 1.025-1.026…..must be stable….use ATO
Alk 8-12dkh is fine, just match your salt to whatever you pick. Must be stable.
CA say 420ppm to 465ppm
MG…your real low….up that to 1400ppm
Nitrate say 5-10ppm and phosphate to 0.03-.1ppm or corals starve and your biological filter matures very very slow.

Get those in check, find ways so they remain at that level and then you should be ready for anything.

 

[Lavey29]

Ha! Good to hear. I may try another Mandarin later on or just wait until I get a bigger tank down the road. They really are one of my favorites, but I don't want to starve the fish or make it miserable either.

You need to wait at least a year for your tank to pass through ugly phases and be established enough with copepods to support a mandarin and even then they can be difficult to acclimate.

 

[Dcloser12]

Don't buy a mandarin. They will die. You need a lot of pods and I mean another. One single mandarin will consume thousands per day. All they do is run around and hunt them. You should add pods every month for 6 months and then every month after to keep a mandarin.

 

[CherryRock]

Got it.....Mandarin = bad and Local Fish Store = bad advice

So if I was going to look into getting some mushrooms or zoa's, does the size matter? Do I need to pick one that's already grown to a decent size? Do I look into getting some frags?

Also for another fish selection, I really like the sand sifting gobies and shrimp pair. Does anyone have any recommendations?

Are there any other good stocking options I am not thinking of?

 

[Dcloser12]

Got it.....Mandarin = bad and Local Fish Store = bad advice

So if I was going to look into getting some mushrooms or zoa's, does the size matter? Do I need to pick one that's already grown to a decent size? Do I look into getting some frags?

Also for another fish selection, I really like the sand sifting gobies and shrimp pair. Does anyone have any recommendations?

Are there any other good stocking options I am not thinking of?

No. They grow quite fast if you spot feed them. Some require a lot of par and high placement with mid flow. Some require little par and low flow. I've cut and fragged my superman about 30x. It gets from about 1/4 inch to 1" in less than a month. I feed it weekly

 

[Kiboshed]

Got it.....Mandarin = bad and Local Fish Store = bad advice

So if I was going to look into getting some mushrooms or zoa's, does the size matter? Do I need to pick one that's already grown to a decent size? Do I look into getting some frags?

Also for another fish selection, I really like the sand sifting gobies and shrimp pair. Does anyone have any recommendations?

Are there any other good stocking options I am not thinking of?

I really wish someone gave me the advice I am about to give you early on: Zoa's are a dice roll, but a vast majority of them are very hardy as long as they are not in extreme flow or light. Though some will fall apart for no apparent reason.

Mushrooms are a very very different story.

Florida Ricordea so far for me are very hard to kill or damage. They like the low-moderate range on light and flow, but can tolerate a lot more than a Discosoma can in terms of flow and light.

Discosoma, LOWER FLOW! This genus really doesn't like higher to even moderate flow in my experience. Again, LOW FLOW. Lower to medium light conditions work best. Haven't really tested "strong" lights. If it is getting slammed by current and touched by fish constantly it WILL jump ship and disattach from its current frag and it becomes very hard to get it to reattach. As far as water quality though it is still very hardy. Find a nice mellow spot with low flow and light and it will be beautiful and strong.

As a fellow begginer I would avoid Yuma.

Have not kept, nor heard much about Rhodactis shrooms.

Also just to get your confidence up; GSP and anything related to Xenia's or Kenya Trees are dang near bullet proof.

All of this is assuming your water parameters are within the "normal" range for saltwater.

 

[davidcalgary29]

I am going to keep prattling on about the wondrous thing that is the Grube's gorgonian until this becomes part of the standard "new reef tank coral suggestions" discussion. Aside from 'shrooms, it's one of the hardiest things you can put in your tank, and they're very adaptable. And so pretty!