New Invert Tank

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

Hello invert fanatics!!! In the coming week I will be setting up my first invert only tank! I had a 40g reef tank for 3 years and I am also getting my bachelors of science in Zoology with plans on getting my PhD in something relating to coral health and conservation. I've taken classes on invertebrate zoology and with my prior experience I feel as if I am ready for this. I had to take a few years off from the hobby because living in a dorm made it close to impossible to keep a tank. I am now in an apartment with adequate time and space to get back into it. However, since I am new to invert only tanks and I am used to having bigger tanks, I would just like to hear yall's opinion and tips on your own tanks.

I've got a 15g AIO tank that I will be adding water and live rock and starting the cycle on Friday. I have never had an AIO tank before, the 40g I had a few years ago was set up with separate pumps and a canister filter. This tank came with a filter sock and a 130gph pump. I am keeping the pump and sock in it but also adding a 118gph pump to get adequate flow. I've dealt with cyano before and ******* hated it so id rather have a little extra flow then too little. However, do you think that 243gph is too much for a 15g? From what I remember, I believe 15 times turn over is adequate so this would be ok??? For the filter, I have some bio balls, regular white filter floss and will be adding some sort of carbon filtration. My question is does anyone have an opinion/preference as to using a regular carbon filter pad or to use the actual activated carbon and throw it in some tights. My high school had SW tanks and the teacher used activated carbon in her canister filters but her tanks were always crashing and fish constantly died so that experience is not a good one for me to reference. I kept carbon filter pads in my canister filter and never had a problem so I might just stick to that but i was just curious as to yalls experience with activated carbon. I will probably eventually discard the filter sock in the future and replace it with filter floss once its used but for now it will stay. I will also probably throw some chaeto in tights at the bottom of the filter because that always helped my tank. Ive got a Lighttimetunnel hanging from my ceiling for a light. I used it for a 20g reef tank I kept like 6 years ago so I know it will work well.

As for stocking it;
Once the cycle is over I will probably put a pair of clowns in it to help establish the tank and make sure its ok to put more sensitive animals in. I will eventually return them but I always like to do a soft introduction of animals especially since inverts are so sensitive. The animals listed below are what I would like to have in the finished product

Coral
-softies are my favorite so some xenia, ricordia and zoanthids would suffice
-Id also like to try gonioproa. I had one in my 40g but it never did well and died but I would like to challenge myself to get a healthy one growing in this tank
-I also think gorgonians are super cool but ive never had one before and im not sure if it would be too big for this tank

Sea cucumbers
-specifically Colochirus robustus (yellow cucumber). I think filter feeders are super cool and would love to have one. This would probably one of the last additions to the tank bc I want to make sure the water column is plentiful with mircro-organisms for it to eat

Sea hares
-Elysia spp. is super cool to me. Anyone have experience with this one specifically? Ive been reading that they have chloroplasts in their bodies which is fascinating to me

Sea stars
-Fromia monoillis is what im looking for since they seem to be the most reef safe? Echinoderms are one of my favorite inverts so I need to have one in the tank (preferably sea stars bc their water vascular system is so intriguing)

Fan worms?
-These guys kind of creep me out but i think it would look sick in the tank

Other
-Probably a crab and a shrimp and ill introduce these early in the tank

I have no experience with any of these inverts besides coral, shrimp and crabs which is why I would love to hear anyone's experience with them. I've done a good amount of research, getting info from live aquaria and lots of forums but I always prefer to hear from personal experience. Is this too much for a 15g? Do I need to worry about any of these critters getting sucked into the AIO inlet? I would be more than happy to put some mesh over the filter and pump inlets. For my filter feeding animals, what do you suggest I use to feed. I used reef roids (and actually have some left over but they might have expired at this point) and my corals loved it, would it be good enough for the cucumber and worm? Should I add just one fish to help with the filter feeders? If I end up wanting to put a fish in there I will probs put a pipefish bc Ive kept them before and they would eat off the micro-organisms. For those who have kept sea stars, do you supply them with other food like shrimp and muscles or do they only eat the detritus?

Let me know your throughs and criticism!!!

 

[nuxx]

Not a usual tank, but I love it

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

Not a usual tank, but I love it

thats pretty much my goal. I love weird things so I think this tank would be perfect!!

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

So, I can’t really help with most of the tank/plumbing stuff, but here’s some info on parts of your post that may be helpful:

Sea hares
-Elysia spp. is super cool to me. Anyone have experience with this one specifically? Ive been reading that they have chloroplasts in their bodies which is fascinating to me

Sea stars
-Fromia monoillis is what im looking for since they seem to be the most reef safe? Echinoderms are one of my favorite inverts so I need to have one in the tank (preferably sea stars bc their water vascular system is so intriguing)

First, more just a semantics point before the useful info: Elysia spp. are Sacoglossan slugs, and while they are related to sea hares (they are both in the Tectipleura subterclass), they are from different taxonomic orders. Most people in the hobby know these as Lettuce Nudibranchs (a misleading name, as they’re not nudibranchs), solar-powered slugs, or sap-sucking slugs - most people don’t consider these sea hares and would likely picture a very different organism upon hearing the term.

Fun fact, the chloroplasts in their body are taken from the algae they feed on (the process is called kleptoplasty).

these guys tend to feed by literally sucking out the insides of the algae’s cells, and they store the plastids from the algae to basically use as an emergency energy supply if needed later.

Now, for the hopefully useful info.

Some lettuce slugs (typically from the genus Elysia) will eat nuisance algae species, but their wild diet varies pretty drastically from one species to another, and some species have some pretty specific wild diets (I don’t know if these are required diets or preferred diets, but Reef Cleaners reports that they'll eat just about any green, fleshy algae). That said, Elysia slugs generally feed on siphonalean algae such as Caulerpa, Codium, Acetabularia, Halimeda, Udotea, Byropsis, and Valonia spp. So, in theory, these guys should eat nuisance algae that pops up in your tank.

With either sacoglossans or sea hares, however, you'll want to make sure you have your plumbing, pumps, powerheads, etc. are proofed for the slug's safety (they have a tendency to climb into the powerheads and die).

And for the sea stars: the most readily available in the hobby, completely reef-safe, true sea stars (though these will eat a variety of sponges and possibly tunicates) are Fromia spp. and Linckia spp. - there are others too, but these are the most common. None of these are known to be successful long term (most of them that I’ve seen die within ~8-12 months). Some people are able to keep them for a few years (typically in large, mature tanks), but most people (even with large, mature tanks) are not able to. They’re natural diet is thought (with quite a lot of strong, supporting evidence) to be biofilm (a blend of different, live microorganisms including bacteria) which we can’t replicate in our tanks at this point.

Alright, bear with me now, I know this is a lot of reading: if you want to keep a Fromia sp. like Fromia monilis, I would reach out to @livinlifeinBKK on the forum here, as they’ve been running an observational study on some Fromia stars with some emphasis on diet and supplemental feeding, and I know they’ve been having some promising looking results with their supplemental feeding of at least one of the species (they’re working on getting the results published on the forum here soon, but I’m not sure when it’ll be published).

It may also be a good idea to introduce/farm Aquilonastra starfish (known erroneously in the hobby as Asterina starfish) if you want to keep a Fromia or Linckia star, as a number of reef safe stars (confirmedly Linckia and a few others, but not confirmedly Fromia) will actively prey on Aquilonastra stars in our aquaria (presumably for the biofilm in/on the smaller star). I’ve seen a few anecdotal reports of at least moderate success (roughly 2-3 years) with Linckia starfish while the Aquilonastra population lasts - from what I’ve heard, eventually, the smallers stars are essentially eradicated from the tank, and the larger star then goes downhill within a few months. Whether Aquilonastra stars are totally reef safe or not is a debated point (I have an info dump about this point available if you would care to read it).

With all of that said, sand sifting stars are also known to be totally reef safe, but they are also known for typically starving (if you want, I can give you an unnecessarily large amount of info on these stars too, but this post is probably already too long).

Personally, unless you’re dead set on keeping a true starfish (Asteroidea), I’d suggest getting a brittle starfish (Ophiuroidea) - these are reef safe and do well in our tanks. You may want to avoid the green “Serpent Star,” Ophiarachna incrassata, however, as it is known to eat fish (it’s a predator) and I’m not sure if it would go inverts or not.

Sea cucumbers
-specifically Colochirus robustus (yellow cucumber).

Colochirus robustus is know for it’s asexual, fissiparous reproduction- it reproduces by dropping the back third of its body, which turns into a new sea cucumber while the original sea cucumber regenerates. It is thought, however, that this is a stress response from the sea cucumber (so if this happens, it’s probably a good idea to check for any potential problems in your tank). Also, while it is much less of a concern in an invert only tank, you should be aware of the toxins that sea cucumbers contain and be prepared to handle any issues involving said toxins should the need arise (yes, I have an info dump available on their toxins too, and, like with the others, I can share it if you want me to).

For my filter feeding animals, what do you suggest I use to feed.

I know the feather duster worms (fan worms) benefit from phytoplankton, so I’d suggest offering some of that (Tetraselmis, Nannochloropsis, Chaetoceros, Isochrysis/T-Isochrysis, and and Thalassiosira are all great phytos for stuff like this, but which one is best varies from one filter feeder species to another - usually a blend is going to give you the best results either way though).I’m not sure on the specific dietary needs of the yellow sea cucumber, but I’d imagine phyto would be a good place to start for them too. From there, foods like reef roids, reef chili, snow reef, marine snow, PNS yellosno, etc. all may or may not be helpful (it really depends again on the species of filter feeder - what may be helpful for one may irritate another).

 

[AydenLincoln]

So, I can’t really help with most of the tank/plumbing stuff, but here’s some info on parts of your post that may be helpful:

First, more just a semantics point before the useful info: Elysia spp. are Sacoglossan slugs, and while they are related to sea hares (they are both in the Tectipleura subterclass), they are from different taxonomic orders. Most people in the hobby know these as Lettuce Nudibranchs (a misleading name, as they’re not nudibranchs), solar-powered slugs, or sap-sucking slugs - most people don’t consider these sea hares and would likely picture a very different organism upon hearing the term.

Fun fact, the chloroplasts in their body are taken from the algae they feed on (the process is called kleptoplasty).

Now, for the hopefully useful info.

And for the sea stars: the most readily available in the hobby, completely reef-safe, true sea stars (though these will eat a variety of sponges and possibly tunicates) are Fromia spp. and Linckia spp. - there are others too, but these are the most common. None of these are known to be successful long term (most of them that I’ve seen die within ~8-12 months). Some people are able to keep them for a few years (typically in large, mature tanks), but most people (even with large, mature tanks) are not able to. They’re natural diet is thought (with quite a lot of strong, supporting evidence) to be biofilm (a blend of different, live microorganisms including bacteria) which we can’t replicate in our tanks at this point.

Alright, bear with me now, I know this is a lot of reading: if you want to keep a Fromia sp. like Fromia monilis, I would reach out to @livinlifeinBKK on the forum here, as they’ve been running an observational study on some Fromia stars with some emphasis on diet and supplemental feeding, and I know they’ve been having some promising looking results with their supplemental feeding of at least one of the species (they’re working on getting the results published on the forum here soon, but I’m not sure when it’ll be published).

It may also be a good idea to introduce/farm Aquilonastra starfish (known erroneously in the hobby as Asterina starfish) if you want to keep a Fromia or Linckia star, as a number of reef safe stars (confirmedly Linckia and a few others, but not confirmedly Fromia) will actively prey on Aquilonastra stars in our aquaria (presumably for the biofilm in/on the smaller star). I’ve seen a few anecdotal reports of at least moderate success (roughly 2-3 years) with Linckia starfish while the Aquilonastra population lasts - from what I’ve heard, eventually, the smallers stars are essentially eradicated from the tank, and the larger star then goes downhill within a few months. Whether Aquilonastra stars are totally reef safe or not is a debated point (I have an info dump about this point available if you would care to read it).

With all of that said, sand sifting stars are also known to be totally reef safe, but they are also known for typically starving (if you want, I can give you an unnecessarily large amount of info on these stars too, but this post is probably already too long).

Personally, unless you’re dead set on keeping a true starfish (Asteroidea), I’d suggest getting a brittle starfish (Ophiuroidea) - these are reef safe and do well in our tanks. You may want to avoid the green “Serpent Star,” Ophiarachna incrassata, however, as it is known to eat fish (it’s a predator) and I’m not sure if it would go inverts or not.

Colochirus robustus is know for it’s asexual, fissiparous reproduction- it reproduces by dropping the back third of its body, which turns into a new sea cucumber while the original sea cucumber regenerates. It is thought, however, that this is a stress response from the sea cucumber (so if this happens, it’s probably a good idea to check for any potential problems in your tank). Also, while it is much less of a concern in an invert only tank, you should be aware of the toxins that sea cucumbers contain and be prepared to handle any issues involving said toxins should the need arise (yes, I have an info dump available on their toxins too, and, like with the others, I can share it if you want me to).

I know the feather duster worms (fan worms) benefit from phytoplankton, so I’d suggest offering some of that (Tetraselmis, Nannochloropsis, Chaetoceros, Isochrysis/T-Isochrysis, and and Thalassiosira are all great phytos for stuff like this, but which one is best varies from one filter feeder species to another - usually a blend is going to give you the best results either way though).I’m not sure on the specific dietary needs of the yellow sea cucumber, but I’d imagine phyto would be a good place to start for them too. From there, foods like reef roids, reef chili, snow reef, marine snow, PNS yellosno, etc. all may or may not be helpful (it really depends again on the species of filter feeder - what may be helpful for one may irritate another).

Emphasis on the starfish!!! Fromia are super sensitive and need a well established tank with enough food and should be supplementally fed if they accept it.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

As for stocking it;
Once the cycle is over I will probably put a pair of clowns in it to help establish the tank and make sure its ok to put more sensitive animals in. I will eventually return them but I always like to do a soft introduction of animals especially since inverts are so sensitive. The animals listed below are what I would like to have in the finished product

Coral
-softies are my favorite so some xenia, ricordia and zoanthids would suffice
-Id also like to try gonioproa. I had one in my 40g but it never did well and died but I would like to challenge myself to get a healthy one growing in this tank
-I also think gorgonians are super cool but ive never had one before and im not sure if it would be too big for this tank

Sea cucumbers
-specifically Colochirus robustus (yellow cucumber). I think filter feeders are super cool and would love to have one. This would probably one of the last additions to the tank bc I want to make sure the water column is plentiful with mircro-organisms for it to eat

Sea hares
-Elysia spp. is super cool to me. Anyone have experience with this one specifically? Ive been reading that they have chloroplasts in their bodies which is fascinating to me

Sea stars
-Fromia monoillis is what im looking for since they seem to be the most reef safe? Echinoderms are one of my favorite inverts so I need to have one in the tank (preferably sea stars bc their water vascular system is so intriguing)

Fan worms?
-These guys kind of creep me out but i think it would look sick in the tank

Other
-Probably a crab and a shrimp and ill introduce these early in the tank

I have no experience with any of these inverts besides coral, shrimp and crabs which is why I would love to hear anyone's experience with them. I've done a good amount of research, getting info from live aquaria and lots of forums but I always prefer to hear from personal experience. Is this too much for a 15g? Do I need to worry about any of these critters getting sucked into the AIO inlet? I would be more than happy to put some mesh over the filter and pump inlets. For my filter feeding animals, what do you suggest I use to feed. I used reef roids (and actually have some left over but they might have expired at this point) and my corals loved it, would it be good enough for the cucumber and worm? Should I add just one fish to help with the filter feeders? If I end up wanting to put a fish in there I will probs put a pipefish bc Ive kept them before and they would eat off the micro-organisms. For those who have kept sea stars, do you supply them with other food like shrimp and muscles or do they only eat the detritus?

Let me know your throughs and criticism!!!

Ok, so, @ISpeakForTheSeas gave you some sound advice and I'd definitely listen to his input. I currently keep a nano invert tank (although not an AIO). All I use for filtration is a cheap, small HOB filter and will very occasionally add activated carbon to a small bag and stick it in the back primarily just for the enhanced water clarity. I do keep hard corals in my tank including some SPS so I prefer to keep nutrients low which can be difficult with a nano considering the inverts you'd like to have. (According to others' experiences, Reef Roids in particular can lead to high phosphates quickly.) I house a few filter feeders in my tank including a clam, feather duster, pink and orange filter feeding cucumber, as well as recently added Christmas Tree Worms which are a true joy and quickly becoming one of my favorites. I currently feed Reef Roids once to twice a week, a mix of live phyto species daily, a small daily dose of AF Phyto Mix, as well as dosing AF amino acids for the SPS.

Do you plan on adding hard corals down the road, if so, nutrient levels are something to keep in mind and will need to be kept in check. Softies such as the zoas you mentioned don't mind higher nutrients however. If you have a fish, I believe it will make the nutrient cycle more natural but if you do add one, be sure that it's a fish you plan to keep and won't be removing anytime soon. I used to have a couple clowns in this same nano and removing them was an enormous pain maneuvering the net between the rockwork and occasionally knocking over corals as they darted from side to side and into the cave I have set up. I would not add a temporary fish to my nano again unless it's a species that will never outgrow the tank or cause nutrients issues from feeding.

As for my pink and orange filter feeding cucumber, I love him. Beware, however, that much like anemones, they can and will move wherever they please which may not be where you prefer them to be. Mine started in a perfect location for viewing but one day decided to go on a little adventure and worked his way up the glass to wedge himself between the HOB filter intake and glass. (I assume he enjoys the flow here.) I've had him for several months now and he seems to be doing well. I'm sure he appreciates the Reef Roids and AF Phyto Mix since it contains particulates he can catch in his tentacles and feed on. A fish would also contribute to detritus he could consume. Beware of their toxin as mentioned above and if you don't like where he is, I would just try changing the flow. I heard an account of a man who was sent to the ER from handling a similar species in an effort to move it.

Common feather dusters are easily kept and as mentioned by @ISpeakForTheSeas will benefit from feeding a live phytoplankton mix although with a fish they would have particulate matter in the water column from the food. I have all wild live rock in my nanos and one just started sprouting up on its own off the side of one of these rocks and has grown to full size without me doing anything special for it. The fact that it grew from microscopic size to fully (or almost fully grown) without special care is notable and points to their ease in care requirements.

Now for the starfish. It's true that I have been doing an independent research study for months now and have written a report on my feeding/nutrition observations which I recently submitted to be published as an article but is still being edited. Starfish are a personal fascination of mine (I ran an entire independent research study on Fromia species, specifically with emphasis on Fromia indica.) Although my results have been promising and I've had each of the 3 consistently gain weight during the study, their feeding regimen is very demanding and they are certainly not self-sustaining (you can read about this soon hopefully). While I will have had the oldest F. indica star for a full year which greatly exceeds the 6 month general life expectancy in aquariums, I'd not recommend you add a true Asteroidea starfish such as this. I could tell you my feeding regimen that's led to weight gains but diets and willingness to take supplemental feedings vary within this genus. However, something I disagree with is the hypersensitivity commonly mentioned and the absolute requirement of a very mature system. My research contradicts this belief rather directly. Of course a mature system is "preferred" by every organism but is not a requirement except for certain organisms which rely upon bacterial relationships which would be present in a mature system but not a younger one. I'd recommend a brittle star or serpent star personally. If you are the type of guy that is going to get and Asteroidea species regardless though (there are people who have their mind made up before asking for advice and won't take given advice no matter what it may be), I would advise you to at least read my report so you know what you're getting into. I don't have experience with Fromia monilis specifically but they've been documented to feed primarily on biofilm and there are no guarantees that they would accept anything offered. Yes, if you google them I'm sure there are blogs with people who've kept them for a few months. Starvation is slow due to their slow metabolism and many times signs of ill health aren't evident until the last few days before they basically disintegrate with no known way to reverse this process. I hope your not content with having it slowly starve over a period of months even though it would look pretty while starving to death (this is acceptable for some people sadly and after it dies they'll just replace it with another).

I can post a few pics of my cucumber, the feather duster that grew out of nowhere, and the clam if you like.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

The feather duster in the middle of the last pic i didn't add...it grew out of the wild live rock. I'd advise you to start the tank with wild live rock if you can as it will help to mature the tank more quickly due to the biodiversity, minimize the "ugly stage" (ive never had one in my tanks personally and credit that to the wild live rock, and give you little surprises like i got with the feather duster. I have two threads about hitchhikers and the general consensus is that they're not nearly as much of a concern as a lot of people have been told...you can review the threads if you like. Btw, I'd avoid adding crabs if i were you-even hermits. As scavengers they will try to feed on anything they can. It's wouldn't be unexpected for you to get them as hitchhikers on wild live rock though but they can be removed with a few tricks if you need to get them out.
Also included is a video of the cucumber eating at the bottom of my post...watch it...pretty cool and absolutely beautiful!

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

So, I can’t really help with most of the tank/plumbing stuff, but here’s some info on parts of your post that may be helpful:

First, more just a semantics point before the useful info: Elysia spp. are Sacoglossan slugs, and while they are related to sea hares (they are both in the Tectipleura subterclass), they are from different taxonomic orders. Most people in the hobby know these as Lettuce Nudibranchs (a misleading name, as they’re not nudibranchs), solar-powered slugs, or sap-sucking slugs - most people don’t consider these sea hares and would likely picture a very different organism upon hearing the term.

Fun fact, the chloroplasts in their body are taken from the algae they feed on (the process is called kleptoplasty).

Now, for the hopefully useful info.

And for the sea stars: the most readily available in the hobby, completely reef-safe, true sea stars (though these will eat a variety of sponges and possibly tunicates) are Fromia spp. and Linckia spp. - there are others too, but these are the most common. None of these are known to be successful long term (most of them that I’ve seen die within ~8-12 months). Some people are able to keep them for a few years (typically in large, mature tanks), but most people (even with large, mature tanks) are not able to. They’re natural diet is thought (with quite a lot of strong, supporting evidence) to be biofilm (a blend of different, live microorganisms including bacteria) which we can’t replicate in our tanks at this point.

Alright, bear with me now, I know this is a lot of reading: if you want to keep a Fromia sp. like Fromia monilis, I would reach out to @livinlifeinBKK on the forum here, as they’ve been running an observational study on some Fromia stars with some emphasis on diet and supplemental feeding, and I know they’ve been having some promising looking results with their supplemental feeding of at least one of the species (they’re working on getting the results published on the forum here soon, but I’m not sure when it’ll be published).

It may also be a good idea to introduce/farm Aquilonastra starfish (known erroneously in the hobby as Asterina starfish) if you want to keep a Fromia or Linckia star, as a number of reef safe stars (confirmedly Linckia and a few others, but not confirmedly Fromia) will actively prey on Aquilonastra stars in our aquaria (presumably for the biofilm in/on the smaller star). I’ve seen a few anecdotal reports of at least moderate success (roughly 2-3 years) with Linckia starfish while the Aquilonastra population lasts - from what I’ve heard, eventually, the smallers stars are essentially eradicated from the tank, and the larger star then goes downhill within a few months. Whether Aquilonastra stars are totally reef safe or not is a debated point (I have an info dump about this point available if you would care to read it).

With all of that said, sand sifting stars are also known to be totally reef safe, but they are also known for typically starving (if you want, I can give you an unnecessarily large amount of info on these stars too, but this post is probably already too long).

Personally, unless you’re dead set on keeping a true starfish (Asteroidea), I’d suggest getting a brittle starfish (Ophiuroidea) - these are reef safe and do well in our tanks. You may want to avoid the green “Serpent Star,” Ophiarachna incrassata, however, as it is known to eat fish (it’s a predator) and I’m not sure if it would go inverts or not.

Colochirus robustus is know for it’s asexual, fissiparous reproduction- it reproduces by dropping the back third of its body, which turns into a new sea cucumber while the original sea cucumber regenerates. It is thought, however, that this is a stress response from the sea cucumber (so if this happens, it’s probably a good idea to check for any potential problems in your tank). Also, while it is much less of a concern in an invert only tank, you should be aware of the toxins that sea cucumbers contain and be prepared to handle any issues involving said toxins should the need arise (yes, I have an info dump available on their toxins too, and, like with the others, I can share it if you want me to).

I know the feather duster worms (fan worms) benefit from phytoplankton, so I’d suggest offering some of that (Tetraselmis, Nannochloropsis, Chaetoceros, Isochrysis/T-Isochrysis, and and Thalassiosira are all great phytos for stuff like this, but which one is best varies from one filter feeder species to another - usually a blend is going to give you the best results either way though).I’m not sure on the specific dietary needs of the yellow sea cucumber, but I’d imagine phyto would be a good place to start for them too. From there, foods like reef roids, reef chili, snow reef, marine snow, PNS yellosno, etc. all may or may not be helpful (it really depends again on the species of filter feeder - what may be helpful for one may irritate another).

Wow, this is fantastic, thank you so much!!!

I did not know that Elysia spp. is a slug instead of a hare. Doesn't make much of a difference to me but is good knowledge! A quick trip to Wikipedia clarified this for me. I was planning on keeping macro algae in there for looks and for feed but it seems like these guys will take care of any nuisance algae that will grow in the tank.

I am not dead set on keeping Asteroidea but I would prefer them over a ophiuroids. I will have to look into the Aquilonastra farming and reach out to the person whom you mentioned.

I am aware that is how cucumbers reproduce. I am ok with it since my Invert. professor is also setting up a tank so I will probs just give it to her lol.

I will definatly look into some phyto plankton since a lot of the filter feeders will benefit from it!!

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

Ok, so, @ISpeakForTheSeas gave you some sound advice and I'd definitely listen to his input. I currently keep a nano invert tank (although not an AIO). All I use for filtration is a cheap, small HOB filter and will very occasionally add activated carbon to a small bag and stick it in the back primarily just for the enhanced water clarity. I do keep hard corals in my tank including some SPS so I prefer to keep nutrients low which can be difficult with a nano considering the inverts you'd like to have. (According to others' experiences, Reef Roids in particular can lead to high phosphates quickly.) I house a few filter feeders in my tank including a clam, feather duster, pink and orange filter feeding cucumber, as well as recently added Christmas Tree Worms which are a true joy and quickly becoming one of my favorites. I currently feed Reef Roids once to twice a week, a mix of live phyto species daily, a small daily dose of AF Phyto Mix, as well as dosing AF amino acids for the SPS.

Do you plan on adding hard corals down the road, if so, nutrient levels are something to keep in mind and will need to be kept in check. Softies such as the zoas you mentioned don't mind higher nutrients however. If you have a fish, I believe it will make the nutrient cycle more natural but if you do add one, be sure that it's a fish you plan to keep and won't be removing anytime soon. I used to have a couple clowns in this same nano and removing them was an enormous pain maneuvering the net between the rockwork and occasionally knocking over corals as they darted from side to side and into the cave I have set up. I would not add a temporary fish to my nano again unless it's a species that will never outgrow the tank or cause nutrients issues from feeding.

As for my pink and orange filter feeding cucumber, I love him. Beware, however, that much like anemones, they can and will move wherever they please which may not be where you prefer them to be. Mine started in a perfect location for viewing but one day decided to go on a little adventure and worked his way up the glass to wedge himself between the HOB filter intake and glass. (I assume he enjoys the flow here.) I've had him for several months now and he seems to be doing well. I'm sure he appreciates the Reef Roids and AF Phyto Mix since it contains particulates he can catch in his tentacles and feed on. A fish would also contribute to detritus he could consume. Beware of their toxin as mentioned above and if you don't like where he is, I would just try changing the flow. I heard an account of a man who was sent to the ER from handling a similar species in an effort to move it.

Common feather dusters are easily kept and as mentioned by @ISpeakForTheSeas will benefit from feeding a live phytoplankton mix although with a fish they would have particulate matter in the water column from the food. I have all wild live rock in my nanos and one just started sprouting up on its own off the side of one of these rocks and has grown to full size without me doing anything special for it. The fact that it grew from microscopic size to fully (or almost fully grown) without special care is notable and points to their ease in care requirements.

Now for the starfish. It's true that I have been doing an independent research study for months now and have written a report on my feeding/nutrition observations which I recently submitted to be published as an article but is still being edited. Starfish are a personal fascination of mine (I ran an entire independent research study on Fromia species, specifically with emphasis on Fromia indica.) Although my results have been promising and I've had each of the 3 consistently gain weight during the study, their feeding regimen is very demanding and they are certainly not self-sustaining (you can read about this soon hopefully). While I will have had the oldest F. indica star for a full year which greatly exceeds the 6 month general life expectancy in aquariums, I'd not recommend you add a true Asteroidea starfish such as this. I could tell you my feeding regimen that's led to weight gains but diets and willingness to take supplemental feedings vary within this genus. However, something I disagree with is the hypersensitivity commonly mentioned and the absolute requirement of a very mature system. My research contradicts this belief rather directly. Of course a mature system is "preferred" by every organism but is not a requirement except for certain organisms which rely upon bacterial relationships which would be present in a mature system but not a younger one. I'd recommend a brittle star or serpent star personally. If you are the type of guy that is going to get and Asteroidea species regardless though (there are people who have their mind made up before asking for advice and won't take given advice no matter what it may be), I would advise you to at least read my report so you know what you're getting into. I don't have experience with Fromia monilis specifically but they've been documented to feed primarily on biofilm and there are no guarantees that they would accept anything offered. Yes, if you google them I'm sure there are blogs with people who've kept them for a few months. Starvation is slow due to their slow metabolism and many times signs of ill health aren't evident until the last few days before they basically disintegrate with no known way to reverse this process. I hope your not content with having it slowly starve over a period of months even though it would look pretty while starving to death (this is acceptable for some people sadly and after it dies they'll just replace it with another).

I can post a few pics of my cucumber, the feather duster that grew out of nowhere, and the clam if you like.

Thank you so much for your input!

I believe my filter set up will do just fine. I will probably just stick to the carbon pad since that is what I'm more familiar with but its nice to know you have had success with activated carbon.

I don't plan on adding any SPS corals. I don't have experience with them and I'm a little scared of them since they are so delicate. I am really a fan of the move and flow of soft and some LPS coral so I don't intend on getting any SPS.

As for the fish, I do also believe that it would make the nutrient cycle more complete. I will have to take a look at my local fish store to see what they have that will be suitable for the tank. I still have time to think about this since the cycle will start tomorrow and that takes a few weeks. And as for the live rock, I only use live rock in my tank. There's a guy who lives 40 mins south of me and has hundreds of lbs of live rock from fiji! He said its got sponges and sorts of other stuff growing on it so Im super excited to get that going (and hes only charging me 5$ her lbs which is making my broke college heart so happy)!!

As for the cucumber, I was not under the impression that they are sessile. I guess htat makes sense since they are filter feeders. I did want a moving cuc but I am also in LOVE with those pics your posted. I will definitely still get the yellow one but I also will look into a regular moving one. I really wanted some sort of deposit feeder in the tank...other than another cuc do you have any suggestions?

Lastly, the star. It seems as if most people are steering me clear of the asteroids. I really appreciate their look but from everyone's input I will probably end up getting a brittle star. However, I would still really like to read your article and what you found! I plan to go into some sort of research pertaining to inverts and love to read peoples findings. I am also super new to research and am trying to get my name out there and network. Im not sure as to where you are located but I would love to learn more about what you have found and if you plan to do futher research. My personal email is [email protected] if you would like to talk more about it!!!

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

As for the cucumber, I was not under the impression that they are sessile. I guess htat makes sense since they are filter feeders. I did want a moving cuc but I am also in LOVE with those pics your posted. I will definitely still get the yellow one but I also will look into a regular moving one. I really wanted some sort of deposit feeder in the tank...other than another cuc do you have any suggestions?

There are both sessile filter feeding sea cucumbers and mobile deposit feeding sea cucumbers (the deposit feeders are generally larger and less colorful though, and you don't get to see the beautiful filter feeding appendages on them like you do of the filter feeders). You could likely fit a Sand Sifting Sea Cucumber (that's the common name for a few different, small deposit feeding cucumber species) in a 15 gallon - KP Aquatics sells them, and so does Seahorse Savvy. These guys do tend to be less visible than their filter feeding relatives though. For feeding the deposit feeders, you would want some tiny, sinking foods (I've only looked at a few of the larger deposit feeding species, but it seems most deposit feeding cukes aren't very picky about food as long as it's small enough to be sifted from the sand - so it's pretty easy to meet their nutritional needs) - something like TDO Chroma Boost Type A or something similar in size that can be mixed in with sand is my recommendation.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Thank you so much for your input!

I believe my filter set up will do just fine. I will probably just stick to the carbon pad since that is what I'm more familiar with but its nice to know you have had success with activated carbon.

I don't plan on adding any SPS corals. I don't have experience with them and I'm a little scared of them since they are so delicate. I am really a fan of the move and flow of soft and some LPS coral so I don't intend on getting any SPS.

As for the fish, I do also believe that it would make the nutrient cycle more complete. I will have to take a look at my local fish store to see what they have that will be suitable for the tank. I still have time to think about this since the cycle will start tomorrow and that takes a few weeks. And as for the live rock, I only use live rock in my tank. There's a guy who lives 40 mins south of me and has hundreds of lbs of live rock from fiji! He said its got sponges and sorts of other stuff growing on it so Im super excited to get that going (and hes only charging me 5$ her lbs which is making my broke college heart so happy)!!

As for the cucumber, I was not under the impression that they are sessile. I guess htat makes sense since they are filter feeders. I did want a moving cuc but I am also in LOVE with those pics your posted. I will definitely still get the yellow one but I also will look into a regular moving one. I really wanted some sort of deposit feeder in the tank...other than another cuc do you have any suggestions?

Lastly, the star. It seems as if most people are steering me clear of the asteroids. I really appreciate their look but from everyone's input I will probably end up getting a brittle star. However, I would still really like to read your article and what you found! I plan to go into some sort of research pertaining to inverts and love to read peoples findings. I am also super new to research and am trying to get my name out there and network. Im not sure as to where you are located but I would love to learn more about what you have found and if you plan to do futher research. My personal email is [email protected] if you would like to talk more about it!!!

I'm happy to hear you're going the live rock route! If it's coming from an established tank and does have microfauna on it I would not dose ammonia for a cycle. It will kill off the sponges and other "extras" on the rock. If its been in his tank for a while then it already has all the nitrifying bacteria needed to convert ammonia into nitrite and then nitrate so you can save yourself the few weeks of cycling and get to the exciting part! Oh, a couple more things- the pipefish is a copepod eater which is unlikely to have enough pods in a 15 gallon to survive for too long unfortunately. Gorgonians are cool btw, there are photosynthetic gorgonians and non photosynthetic. Most would be a fine choice to go with the filter feeders you mentioned and you can simply cut them down to the size that will fit in your tank.
BTW, did you watch the video at the bottom of my last post? I love watching him filter feed!

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

I'm happy to hear you're going the live rock route! If it's coming from an established tank and does have microfauna on it I would not dose ammonia for a cycle. It will kill off the sponges and other "extras" on the rock. If its been in his tank for a while then it already has all the nitrifying bacteria needed to convert ammonia into nitrite and then nitrate so you can save yourself the few weeks of cycling and get to the exciting part! Oh, a couple more things- the pipefish is a copepod eater which is unlikely to have enough pods in a 15 gallon to survive for too long unfortunately. Gorgonians are cool btw, there are photosynthetic gorgonians and non photosynthetic. Most would be a fine choice to go with the filter feeders you mentioned and you can simply cut them down to the size that will fit in your tank.
BTW, did you watch the video at the bottom of my last post? I love watching him filter feed!

Hmm ok. The rock is not in a "tank" but is stored in a large shallow tub filled with water. I have only ever cycled tanks by dosing ammonia (i usually just put a piece of shrimp in some tights and let it sit in the tank until the nitrates spike) and am unsure how to start them otherwise. Would I just add the rock and water and it will be ok? I was planning on dosing the tank with copepods but im thinking of just keeping a more typical fish to save me the hassle.
And yes I did see the video. Absolutely fascinating!!

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

There are both sessile filter feeding sea cucumbers and mobile deposit feeding sea cucumbers (the deposit feeders are generally larger and less colorful though, and you don't get to see the beautiful filter feeding appendages on them like you do of the filter feeders). You could likely fit a Sand Sifting Sea Cucumber (that's the common name for a few different, small deposit feeding cucumber species) in a 15 gallon - KP Aquatics sells them, and so does Seahorse Savvy. These guys do tend to be less visible than their filter feeding relatives though. For feeding the deposit feeders, you would want some tiny, sinking foods (I've only looked at a few of the larger deposit feeding species, but it seems most deposit feeding cukes aren't very picky about food as long as it's small enough to be sifted from the sand - so it's pretty easy to meet their nutritional needs) - something like TDO Chroma Boost Type A or something similar in size that can be mixed in with sand is my recommendation.

I was mostly talking about the yellow cuc - I didn't know that that species specifically was sessile. I do know that most cucs are very dull and boring looking but I do think that deposit feeders are very cool. Ill have to do some more research as to what other animals are deposit feeders that would do well in a 15g. Since I will most likely keep just one fish in there would I still need to add sinking foods or would the waste and extra food from the fish be enough?

 

[nuxx]

thats pretty much my goal. I love weird things so I think this tank would be perfect!!

Kind of like me... I like something more because other people don't have it

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Hmm ok. The rock is not in a "tank" but is stored in a large shallow tub filled with water. I have only ever cycled tanks by dosing ammonia (i usually just put a piece of shrimp in some tights and let it sit in the tank until the nitrates spike) and am unsure how to start them otherwise. Would I just add the rock and water and it will be ok? I was planning on dosing the tank with copepods but im thinking of just keeping a more typical fish to save me the hassle.
And yes I did see the video. Absolutely fascinating!!

If the rock has sponges on it, i'd assume it's been cycled already but you should ask the seller in that case. Yeah, usually you cycle a new tank by adding 2ppm ammonia and then adding bottled bacteria. You know it's cycled after ammonia and nitrites both reach 0. IF the rock is cycled, you wouldn't need to do an additional cycle at all but if you want to play it safe and the seller is rather vague, you can still dose 2ppm ammonia but it should be converted very quickly into nitrite and nitrate since the bacterial population is already established (24-48 hours fast). You will likely kill any sponges and other organisms on the rock if you dose ammonia to 2ppm though because of its high toxicity. You can use a shrimp but then you don't really know your exact ammonia level so id pick up some cheap Fritz ammonium chloride so I know the exact amount.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

I was mostly talking about the yellow cuc - I didn't know that that species specifically was sessile. I do know that most cucs are very dull and boring looking but I do think that deposit feeders are very cool. Ill have to do some more research as to what other animals are deposit feeders that would do well in a 15g. Since I will most likely keep just one fish in there would I still need to add sinking foods or would the waste and extra food from the fish be enough?

As long as that fish is fed relatively heavily, it'd probably be enough for most small deposit feeders (though you'd obviously want to observe how they're doing and increase the feeding if needed).

 

[Savanna’sReefAndFish]

If the rock has sponges on it, i'd assume it's been cycled already but you should ask the seller in that case. Yeah, usually you cycle a new tank by adding 2ppm ammonia and then adding bottled bacteria. You know it's cycled after ammonia and nitrites both reach 0. IF the rock is cycled, you wouldn't need to do an additional cycle at all but if you want to play it safe and the seller is rather vague, you can still dose 2ppm ammonia but it should be converted very quickly into nitrite and nitrate since the bacterial population is already established (24-48 hours fast). You will likely kill any sponges and other organisms on the rock if you dose ammonia to 2ppm though because of its high toxicity. You can use a shrimp but then you don't really know your exact ammonia level so id pick up some cheap Fritz ammonium chloride so I know the exact amount.

ok. I will have to ask him tomorrow when I pick it up. Thanks for all the help!!

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

ok. I will have to ask him tomorrow when I pick it up. Thanks for all the help!!

No problem! Feel free to send me a private message on here if you have any questions or just want to chat about reefing!

 

[Ichtha_yo Stuff]

I am also starting an invert only tank. It is a 20 gallon innovative marine. I just ordered a bunch of inverts from Alyssa’s seahorse savvy. I have some corals and some macroalgae. It should be an interesting journey. I am looking forward to seeing how your tank progresses and what successes you have.