Need Treatment Advice / Thoughts

[AmberOwl145]

Hi all,

I had a seahorse who just died, and sadly have one left that I really want to save. The one remaining recently stopped eating yesterday, so I am assuming he may have the same illness as the other one was (pattern was first avoiding food, then a day or two later heavier breathing, panting, laying on side, and then death). So if he has the same sickness, then the clock is ticking to save him.

After a bit of research, I ordered Ruby Rally but unfortunately it doesn't arrive until Friday, so I was able to get Paraguard and API General Cure.
After reading, and the symptoms of the seahorses, I took a shot in the dark and just started my first dose of General Cure.

He's still not eating, but doesn't seem worse either - it's only been 3 hours, so clearly not much time, but does anyone think I should be doing anything else, or mixing any additional medicine given the relatively short window of time that the seahorse can live without food (perhaps 4-5 days)?

My fear is the medicine doesn't work, and I need to try something else and run out of time due to starvation.

Any recommendations on what (else) I should be doing over the next week?

Thanks!

 

[MnFish1]

Hi all,

I had a seahorse who just died, and sadly have one left that I really want to save. The one remaining recently stopped eating yesterday, so I am assuming he may have the same illness as the other one was (pattern was first avoiding food, then a day or two later heavier breathing, panting, laying on side, and then death). So if he has the same sickness, then the clock is ticking to save him.

After a bit of research, I ordered Ruby Rally but unfortunately it doesn't arrive until Friday, so I was able to get Paraguard and API General Cure.
After reading, and the symptoms of the seahorses, I took a shot in the dark and just started my first dose of General Cure.

He's still not eating, but doesn't seem worse either - it's only been 3 hours, so clearly not much time, but does anyone think I should be doing anything else, or mixing any additional medicine given the relatively short window of time that the seahorse can live without food (perhaps 4-5 days)?

My fear is the medicine doesn't work, and I need to try something else and run out of time due to starvation.

Any recommendations on what (else) I should be doing over the next week?

Thanks!

How old is the fish that died - and the current one. Any new additions? Assuming your parameters are ok - and no other changes? Any inverts in the tank?

 

[AmberOwl145]

How old is the fish that died - and the current one. Any new additions? Assuming your parameters are ok - and no other changes? Any inverts in the tank?

The seahorses were in the tank for ~8-9 months.

I have two elephant ear sponges, but aside from that nothing else, no other fish, no coral.

33 gallon tank
8.1 pH
Water temperature: 72.6f
ammonia: 0
nitrite: 0
nitrate: ~0.03
alkalinity: 11.2 KH
ph3 (phosphate): ~0.2

 

[AmberOwl145]

How old is the fish that died - and the current one. Any new additions? Assuming your parameters are ok - and no other changes? Any inverts in the tank?

ugh maybe it's me, but his breathing does seem slightly faster now - probably not long enough with the medicine, right? if I don't see improvements by tomorrow, would you say I treated for the wrong thing? Unfamiliar if I should try multiple medicines at same time my instinct is not to but not sure.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi all,

I had a seahorse who just died, and sadly have one left that I really want to save. The one remaining recently stopped eating yesterday, so I am assuming he may have the same illness as the other one was (pattern was first avoiding food, then a day or two later heavier breathing, panting, laying on side, and then death). So if he has the same sickness, then the clock is ticking to save him.

After a bit of research, I ordered Ruby Rally but unfortunately it doesn't arrive until Friday, so I was able to get Paraguard and API General Cure.
After reading, and the symptoms of the seahorses, I took a shot in the dark and just started my first dose of General Cure.

He's still not eating, but doesn't seem worse either - it's only been 3 hours, so clearly not much time, but does anyone think I should be doing anything else, or mixing any additional medicine given the relatively short window of time that the seahorse can live without food (perhaps 4-5 days)?

My fear is the medicine doesn't work, and I need to try something else and run out of time due to starvation.

Any recommendations on what (else) I should be doing over the next week?

Thanks!

I personally would not mix seahorse with fish as they cannot compete for food. Any heavy breathing with seahorse, cloudy eyes or loss of appetite?
Can possibly be ectoparasites which they are susceptible to and while risky can be addressed with freshwater dips. Other would be gill flukes which can cause them to suffocate

 

[AmberOwl145]

I personally would not mix seahorse with fish as they cannot compete for food. Any heavy breathing with seahorse, cloudy eyes or loss of appetite?
Can possibly be ectoparasites which they are susceptible to and while risky can be addressed with freshwater dips. Other would be gill flukes which can cause them to suffocate

I'm getting scared..


So the previous seahorse died like this:

Day1:
He just stopped moving, and preferred to attach to a hitching post and not move. Maybe after a few hours, I'd see him somewhere else
He tried eating, spit the food out, then stopped eating

Day2:
started to prefer hitching horizontally, and upside down
Eyes slowly stopped moving a lot, like instead of always darting around, just stared with almost no moving

Day3:
breathing rates increased, from 30 breaths a minute to 50, to 70+ over 3 days

Around step 4 (day 2) I did a freshwater dip, about 9 minutes, and after a while of moving around he laid still as if dead. I brought him back, and he went back to his position.

Day4:

6) Stopped moving, seemed very weak
7) Started going around crazy at night, as if delirious, often laying on sand.

Day5: dead on sand in morning


For my remaining seahorse, I am now seeing him laying horizontally now, and his breathing seems to be increasing, eye movement seems to be less. He is mimicking what the other one did.


I'm going to be so sad if I lose my only thing left in the tank - is there anything else I should do here? Force feeding with a pipette? Other medicine?

 

[AmberOwl145]

I personally would not mix seahorse with fish as they cannot compete for food. Any heavy breathing with seahorse, cloudy eyes or loss of appetite?
Can possibly be ectoparasites which they are susceptible to and while risky can be addressed with freshwater dips. Other would be gill flukes which can cause them to suffocate

sorry yes loss of appetite and heavy breathing. What can I do?

 

[vetteguy53081]

sorry yes loss of appetite and heavy breathing. What can I do?

Options are:
Freshwater dip
Ruby rally pro
Methylene Blue used as a dip
Low level formalin based med which are hard to find

 

[AmberOwl145]

Options are:
Freshwater dip
Ruby rally pro
Methylene Blue used as a dip
Low level formalin based med which are hard to find

Just to confirm:


he's currently horizontal and conditions appear to be worsening slightly. I used API General Cure at 2:45PM today.

Based on the fact things seem worse, and still not eating, should I try a freshwater dip tonight, or wait until tomorrow? Keep in mind I did freshwater dip the other one who died and while he did go crazy for a few min, he then just laid there almost dead. Putting him back to the display tank didn't seem to improve his condition but maybe it was b/c he was already weak and dead anyway? I heard seahorses shut down their systems if they don't eat after 4 days so maybe it was too late? My remaining guy hasn't eaten for about 30 hours.

my ruby rally pro arrives tomorrow evening by mail - so would you say just try a dip, then try rally pro once it arrives? Given I have nothing in the tank but an elephant ear sponge, I can just put the rally pro in the tank right?

Do you think it's too late to save him?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Just to confirm:


he's currently horizontal and conditions appear to be worsening slightly. I used API General Cure at 2:45PM today.

Based on the fact things seem worse, and still not eating, should I try a freshwater dip tonight, or wait until tomorrow?

my ruby rally pro arrives tomorrow evening by mail - so would you say just try a dip, then try rally pro once it arrives? Given I have nothing in the tank but an elephant ear sponge, I can just put the rally pro in the tank right?

Do you think it's too late to save him?

FW dip can stress them more. If highly distressed- I would not advise dip
General cure has low level formalin but the metro although low content can have some adverse effect. Increase aeration with air stone

 

[AmberOwl145]

FW dip can stress them more. If highly distressed- I would not advise dip
General cure has low level formalin but the metro although low content can have some adverse effect. Increase aeration with air stone

So you're saying don't FW dip him?

ok thanks now what about Ruby Rally Pro? Should I use it tomorrow when it arrives?

 

[AmberOwl145]

FW dip can stress them more. If highly distressed- I would not advise dip
General cure has low level formalin but the metro although low content can have some adverse effect. Increase aeration with air stone

UPDATE

I just saw white stringy poop come out - kinda surprised. he seemed to be active too when he did it, and stood up. Any changes in your opinion based on this?

 

[MnFish1]

The poop doesn't change it IMHO. General cure will potentially help treat intestinal issues.

 

[vetteguy53081]

UPDATE

I just saw white stringy poop come out - kinda surprised. he seemed to be active too when he did it, and stood up. Any changes in your opinion based on this?

Likely excess mucus which they periodically get. What foods was it eating?

 

[vetteguy53081]

So you're saying don't FW dip him?

ok thanks now what about Ruby Rally Pro? Should I use it tomorrow when it arrives?

Its a risk which could result in loss but they do well with these dips

 

[AmberOwl145]

Its a risk which could result in loss but they do well with these dips

ok maybe I won't do it since it didn't help the other guy, but you still recommend ruby pro?

 

[vetteguy53081]

ok maybe I won't do it since it didn't help the other guy, but you still recommend ruby pro?

Having had seahorses, yes ruby is safe and should help. For bacterial issues if ever occurs, seachem kanaplex is safe and assure temperature is closer to 76-77 degrees and not too warm

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi all,

I had a seahorse who just died, and sadly have one left that I really want to save. The one remaining recently stopped eating yesterday, so I am assuming he may have the same illness as the other one was (pattern was first avoiding food, then a day or two later heavier breathing, panting, laying on side, and then death). So if he has the same sickness, then the clock is ticking to save him.

After a bit of research, I ordered Ruby Rally but unfortunately it doesn't arrive until Friday, so I was able to get Paraguard and API General Cure.
After reading, and the symptoms of the seahorses, I took a shot in the dark and just started my first dose of General Cure.

He's still not eating, but doesn't seem worse either - it's only been 3 hours, so clearly not much time, but does anyone think I should be doing anything else, or mixing any additional medicine given the relatively short window of time that the seahorse can live without food (perhaps 4-5 days)?

My fear is the medicine doesn't work, and I need to try something else and run out of time due to starvation.

Any recommendations on what (else) I should be doing over the next week?

Thanks!

I had responded to your other thread - that seahorse had some gill disease. There is no way to determine the cause though. With the second seahorse showing the same symptoms so soon, some of the issues I mentioned can be ruled out….

This is likely a protozoan gill disease. Formalin would be your best option, but it is difficult to get and really shouldn’t be used in a home due to human health concerns. Ruby Reef isn’t going to be strong enough to do much, and for your fish, it will arrive too late.

General Cure has metronidazole in it. That medication has some benefit against flagellate protozoans, so of the options you have, that is the best one.

 

[AmberOwl145]

I had responded to your other thread - that seahorse had some gill disease. There is no way to determine the cause though. With the second seahorse showing the same symptoms so soon, some of the issues I mentioned can be ruled out….

This is likely a protozoan gill disease. Formalin would be your best option, but it is difficult to get and really shouldn’t be used in a home due to human health concerns. Ruby Reef isn’t going to be strong enough to do much, and for your fish, it will arrive too late.

General Cure has metronidazole in it. That medication has some benefit against flagellate protozoans, so of the options you have, that is the best one.

Jay thanks so much for responding, wanted to share an update get your reaction.

So I half-expected to see him laying horizontally on the sand, but interestingly enough he is now hitched upright. Not sure if that's a positive sign but his breathing is oddly ~40 breaths a minute, instead of 60-70 the other guy had around this time. His eyes still seem to not dart around, staring off into space, just breathing and not moving

Would love your opinion on the following if no trouble:
1) He's showing no interest in food still - do you think I let the medicine run its course (it would be 24 hours as of 2:45pm on 5:30, so in 6 hours from now) and keep trying? Wondering about emergency feeding in the next day or two.

2) When the ruby reef arrives in about 6 hours, should I try it anyway?

3) Anything else I should be doing at this point? Dosing "general cure" sooner than the next dose (tomorrow 5/31)?

THANK YOU!

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Jay thanks so much for responding, wanted to share an update get your reaction.

So I half-expected to see him laying horizontally on the sand, but interestingly enough he is now hitched upright. Not sure if that's a positive sign but his breathing is oddly ~40 breaths a minute, instead of 60-70 the other guy had around this time. His eyes still seem to not dart around, staring off into space, just breathing and not moving

Would love your opinion on the following if no trouble:
1) He's showing no interest in food still - do you think I let the medicine run its course (it would be 24 hours as of 2:45pm on 5:30, so in 6 hours from now) and keep trying? Wondering about emergency feeding in the next day or two.

2) When the ruby reef arrives in about 6 hours, should I try it anyway?

3) Anything else I should be doing at this point? Dosing "general cure" sooner than the next dose (tomorrow 5/31)?

THANK YOU!

I've never tried to tube-feed a seahorse. I have done that with weedy seadragons, but it is very tricky to do on small fish like that. You cannot use a pipette, you need a tiny catheter. Also, seahorses don't have a "stomach" per-se, so the amount of food you can get into them is miniscule.

I can't explain why this seahorse is not breathing fast compared to the last one. This tends to go against the idea that the cause is the same....

I would wait until tomorrow and dose the General Cure again. You can try a Ruby Reef Rally Pro dip, but I'm not confident that either will really work in this case.

As a side note - I still lose a lot of seahorses over time. They just do not survive for me as long as I think they should. With some (tank raised Erectus and pot-bellies) we've been able to breed them fast enough to offset the mortality rate, but we still have issues.

Jay