My Clownfish Keep Dying! Please Help!

[Makaveli]

Hi Everyone,

I am a first time poster and I am hoping someone can help me with an issue I am having introducing new fish in my saltwater tank. At this point there are no corals and one small clownfish that is left.

Tank: 35 Gallon Waterbox All in One
Using only RODI water
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrates: nearly 0
PH: 8.0
Salinity: 1.025
Temp: 78 celcius
Powerhead on one side: AI Nero 3
Powerhead on the other side: regular affordable powerhead
Plenty of surface tension and water flow
NO protein skimmer yet - I have a Aqua Maxx Bullet 2 HOB which I am going to install
In the back chambers, I am running filter floss, chemipure blue and Seachem Matrix.
No Inverts
Currently having a diatom bloom

I started the tank on April 4th, 2024 using Dr. Tim's method and Turbostart Fritz. I was very patient as I have had saltwater tanks in the past and I know that is one of the more important rules. I let the tank cycle and when I was sure the cycle was complete, I added 2 small clowns and a small blue-tang. I understand the blue tang would eventually need a bigger tank but it was a juvinile at this point and my daughter really begged me to get one. Everything was going great, fish were eating and everyone was happy.

I did something dumb - I ordered a yellow tang online and added it to the tank. That is when things started going sideways. Within 2 days my blue tang died. I know they are very high stress fish so it could have been just stress. Then 2 days later the yellow tang died. The next day one of my small clown fish got caught in the powerhead and it died. At this point I was left with one small clown which is still alive and thriving.

I then checked my water parameters and they were perfect.

Needless to say I was losing it and was pretty darn sad as were my kids with all the fish loss.

I added two bigger sized clown fish. They died within 48 hours. I tested my water parameters and they were perfect. I took the water to the LFS (Big Als) and they also tested the water and they said it has nearly perfect parameters. They were at a loss as to why the fish died. They said they kept their salinity at exactly the same as mine, 1.025. I drip acclimated the clowns that died but I don't have QT tank as I don't really have room for one.

I then decided to add one more medium sized clown fish. It lasted 48 hours and died.

All this time, the initial small clownfish is alive, eating and thriving.

I have checked my parameters again and they are the same as I listed at the beginning of the post. I am at a loss as to what the heck is going on. I am not adding any more fish until I figure it out. It is more frustrating because I am somewhat of a perfectionist and when things are not right, I need to figure out why.

It seems like everything went sideways when I added that yellow tang. It was captive bred but I didn't know too much about the store that shipped it, although they have over 700 reviews on Google with a 4.8 rating. The fish looked healthy upon arrival.

I would love any help that I can possible receive and any advice. I have had tanks in the past and never had fish loss. Ever.

I do water changes but again the parameters look fine. I have attached one video of my tank setup and the other video is of the latest casualty clown fish. The particles you may note are just sand and I didn't notice any spots. However, if you can take a closer look at the Gills, do they look normal?

Can this be clownfish disease?
Is it possible that my water is contaminated?
How is that first tiny soldier clownfish all good and thriving through all of this while any clownfish I add are dying within 48 hours.
Is there too much flow in the tank with the two powerheads for the clowns?

Please help!!!!

Thank you for reading this novel.

 

[MnFish1]

First welcome, and sorry about your tank!

The fact that 3 fish died fairly quickly suggest a disease of some sort - assuming your parameter tests were correct. The fact that one fish is alive suggests it's not a toxin - but some are more susceptible. The fact that it occured so quickly after adding the yellow tank suggests velvet - with breathing difficulty. Though tangs can get brooklynella, it's not common - and you didn't describe any symptoms that suggest that. Could there be 2 diseases? (i.e. brook and velvet) - yes its possible. I would guess that fluke deaths would be more spread out.

If I understand, though, you have one clown left thats doing fine, eating well, no lesions, etc. If you haven't quarantined that fish (our protocol is above) I would remove the clown to a hospital tank, and treat with copper and then prazipro. I would leave your display tank fallow for 6-8 weeks - since you have no inverts, you could increase the temp to 81.

During this period, I would watch the clown for any symptoms suggesting brooklynella, which would change recommendations.

BTW - it's also possible that you could treat your display tank - but then there is an issue of copper adsorbing to rock, etc.

BTW 2 - it's unlikely that your one clown was 'sucked into' the powerhead unless it was already sick and unable to swim well.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

2 tangs in a 35 gallon is an invitation for disease to visit your tank. The stress they would be under from lack of swimming space and the stress they would cause to other fish, this was the only possible outcome unfortunately. Its very important to stock according to tank size.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi Everyone,

I am a first time poster and I am hoping someone can help me with an issue I am having introducing new fish in my saltwater tank. At this point there are no corals and one small clownfish that is left.

Tank: 35 Gallon Waterbox All in One
Using only RODI water
Ammonia: 0
Nitrites: 0
Nitrates: nearly 0
PH: 8.0
Salinity: 1.025
Temp: 78 celcius
Powerhead on one side: AI Nero 3
Powerhead on the other side: regular affordable powerhead
Plenty of surface tension and water flow
NO protein skimmer yet - I have a Aqua Maxx Bullet 2 HOB which I am going to install
In the back chambers, I am running filter floss, chemipure blue and Seachem Matrix.
No Inverts
Currently having a diatom bloom

I started the tank on April 4th, 2024 using Dr. Tim's method and Turbostart Fritz. I was very patient as I have had saltwater tanks in the past and I know that is one of the more important rules. I let the tank cycle and when I was sure the cycle was complete, I added 2 small clowns and a small blue-tang. I understand the blue tang would eventually need a bigger tank but it was a juvinile at this point and my daughter really begged me to get one. Everything was going great, fish were eating and everyone was happy.

I did something dumb - I ordered a yellow tang online and added it to the tank. That is when things started going sideways. Within 2 days my blue tang died. I know they are very high stress fish so it could have been just stress. Then 2 days later the yellow tang died. The next day one of my small clown fish got caught in the powerhead and it died. At this point I was left with one small clown which is still alive and thriving.

I then checked my water parameters and they were perfect.

Needless to say I was losing it and was pretty darn sad as were my kids with all the fish loss.

I added two bigger sized clown fish. They died within 48 hours. I tested my water parameters and they were perfect. I took the water to the LFS (Big Als) and they also tested the water and they said it has nearly perfect parameters. They were at a loss as to why the fish died. They said they kept their salinity at exactly the same as mine, 1.025. I drip acclimated the clowns that died but I don't have QT tank as I don't really have room for one.

I then decided to add one more medium sized clown fish. It lasted 48 hours and died.

All this time, the initial small clownfish is alive, eating and thriving.

I have checked my parameters again and they are the same as I listed at the beginning of the post. I am at a loss as to what the heck is going on. I am not adding any more fish until I figure it out. It is more frustrating because I am somewhat of a perfectionist and when things are not right, I need to figure out why.

It seems like everything went sideways when I added that yellow tang. It was captive bred but I didn't know too much about the store that shipped it, although they have over 700 reviews on Google with a 4.8 rating. The fish looked healthy upon arrival.

I would love any help that I can possible receive and any advice. I have had tanks in the past and never had fish loss. Ever.

I do water changes but again the parameters look fine. I have attached one video of my tank setup and the other video is of the latest casualty clown fish. The particles you may note are just sand and I didn't notice any spots. However, if you can take a closer look at the Gills, do they look normal?

Can this be clownfish disease?
Is it possible that my water is contaminated?
How is that first tiny soldier clownfish all good and thriving through all of this while any clownfish I add are dying within 48 hours.
Is there too much flow in the tank with the two powerheads for the clowns?

Please help!!!!

Thank you for reading this novel.

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

One important clue that I use in diagnosing fish issues, specifically disease versus water quality issues is the status of any invertebrates. If both fish and invertebrates are struggling, it is generally a water quality or environmental issue. If fish are dying, but invertebrates are thriving, it is almost always a fish disease. Since you don’t have any invertebrates in the tank, we lose that crucial remote diagnostic tool.

I can’t rule out low dissolved oxygen or high CO2 here. The tank has good circulation, but proper gas exchange requires breaking the surface tension. The skimmer would do that, so would an air stone.

I do think though, there was a disease issue in play, but I do not think all of the fish losses were related.

 

[MnFish1]

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

One important clue that I use in diagnosing fish issues, specifically disease versus water quality issues is the status of any invertebrates. If both fish and invertebrates are struggling, it is generally a water quality or environmental issue. If fish are dying, but invertebrates are thriving, it is almost always a fish disease. Since you don’t have any invertebrates in the tank, we lose that crucial remote diagnostic tool.

I can’t rule out low dissolved oxygen or high CO2 here. The tank has good circulation, but proper gas exchange requires breaking the surface tension. The skimmer would do that, so would an air stone.

I do think though, there was a disease issue in play, but I do not think all of the fish losses were related.

Agree.. Not that that means anything lol. (meaning that just because I agree - does not trump @Jay Hemdal

 

[Makaveli]

Hi,

Thank you everyone for your advice and recommendations. My first plan of action is to add the skimmer and do a large water change. What can I do after this. As mentioned water parameters are fine but test kits don't really measure for toxins in the water correct? If it was a fish disease issue, would I be okay to add more fish after doing the water change and adding a skimmer?

@Jay Hemdal what clue can be provided by the fact that the initial small clown is still doing well after all of this and any new (medium size) clowns I add keep dying. In your opinion, do you think it is an aeration issue? If it was/is a fish disease issue, what is the next step.

I am perfectly fine with leaving the tank alone for 6 to 8 weeks but I am just trying to figure this out. For example, if it is a fish disease issue, is the issue finished when all the fish are gone (except one). If so, then why are the new fish not surviving even 48 hours? I guess what I mean is does fish disease lead to contamination of the water?

The main clues here are that (1) everything started going sideways when that yellow tang was added and (2) the initial clown fish survived while any new clowns are dying.

I forgot to mention that before the yellow tang was added, Everyone was doing great, the two clowns and the small blue tang. They were doing well for over a month. Is that another clue to figure out if this is disease, oxygen issue or toxins in the water?

My LFS.is also confused but I feel like they don't know what they are doing and just keep encouraging me to buy more fish. I don't want to add anything until I figure this out.

Thanks again!

 

[slingfox]

@MnFish1 Has outlined best next steps: Put your last remaining clown fish into a QT tank and treat with copper then Prazi according to the protocol outlined on this board. Leave the display tank follow (ie, do not add any fish) for minimum of 45 days. When you add new fish make sure it is appropriate for the size tank you have.

I know setting up a QT tank may sound daunting but it can be done with a cheap 10 gallon from PetCo and cheap heater and hang on back filter from Amazon. If there is one thing to spend a little more money on for a QT I would recommending getting a Tidal 55 for the 10g. That will move a lot of water and has a large chamber that you can stuff full of aquarium sponge which helps keep the water clean. If the water stays clean you can get away with less water changes. You will also need a reliable copper checker such as Hanna.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

Hi,

Thank you everyone for your advice and recommendations. My first plan of action is to add the skimmer and do a large water change. What can I do after this. As mentioned water parameters are fine but test kits don't really measure for toxins in the water correct? If it was a fish disease issue, would I be okay to add more fish after doing the water change and adding a skimmer?

@Jay Hemdal what clue can be provided by the fact that the initial small clown is still doing well after all of this and any new (medium size) clowns I add keep dying. In your opinion, do you think it is an aeration issue? If it was/is a fish disease issue, what is the next step.

I am perfectly fine with leaving the tank alone for 6 to 8 weeks but I am just trying to figure this out. For example, if it is a fish disease issue, is the issue finished when all the fish are gone (except one). If so, then why are the new fish not surviving even 48 hours? I guess what I mean is does fish disease lead to contamination of the water?

The main clues here are that (1) everything started going sideways when that yellow tang was added and (2) the initial clown fish survived while any new clowns are dying.

I forgot to mention that before the yellow tang was added, Everyone was doing great, the two clowns and the small blue tang. They were doing well for over a month. Is that another clue to figure out if this is disease, oxygen issue or toxins in the water?

My LFS.is also confused but I feel like they don't know what they are doing and just keep encouraging me to buy more fish. I don't want to add anything until I figure this out.

Thanks again!

Your remaining clownfish is now patient zero, it carries the disease but has built up immunity, but other new fishes added will get the disease.

Any stress can bring disease to fish, just like when we are tired and stressed and unhappy, we can get sick easier.

Even without the yellow tang, the tank was a ticking time bomb, it was just a matter of time before the blue tang got stressed enough to catch disease. Your tank is 23 inches wide, and the blue tang grows to 12 inches. and tangs swim several miles every day... it was just a matter of time. If you're LFS didn't know that, its not a good LFS.

The disease cells are now in your tank, even after removing the fish the disease can exist for amount of time, so the tank needs to be fishless.

Impatience will make this hobby frustrating and expensive. Patience, going slow, and research are mandatory for success in this hobby.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi,

Thank you everyone for your advice and recommendations. My first plan of action is to add the skimmer and do a large water change. What can I do after this. As mentioned water parameters are fine but test kits don't really measure for toxins in the water correct? If it was a fish disease issue, would I be okay to add more fish after doing the water change and adding a skimmer?

@Jay Hemdal what clue can be provided by the fact that the initial small clown is still doing well after all of this and any new (medium size) clowns I add keep dying. In your opinion, do you think it is an aeration issue? If it was/is a fish disease issue, what is the next step.

I am perfectly fine with leaving the tank alone for 6 to 8 weeks but I am just trying to figure this out. For example, if it is a fish disease issue, is the issue finished when all the fish are gone (except one). If so, then why are the new fish not surviving even 48 hours? I guess what I mean is does fish disease lead to contamination of the water?

The main clues here are that (1) everything started going sideways when that yellow tang was added and (2) the initial clown fish survived while any new clowns are dying.

I forgot to mention that before the yellow tang was added, Everyone was doing great, the two clowns and the small blue tang. They were doing well for over a month. Is that another clue to figure out if this is disease, oxygen issue or toxins in the water?

My LFS.is also confused but I feel like they don't know what they are doing and just keep encouraging me to buy more fish. I don't want to add anything until I figure this out.

Thanks again!

First - don't buy any new fish yet!

Lack of aeration does not hit all fish equally (unless it is really severe). It isn't unusual for some fish in a tank to die from that and not others.

However, it could also be that there is a disease issue and the small clown just hasn't gotten hit yet. It would be very unusual for a severe parasitic event to sweep through a tank and kill some fish but not others of the same species.

In a perfect world - after updating the aeration, you should wait 30 to 45 days before adding any new fish, and then only add properly quarantined fish.

 

[Makaveli]

First - don't buy any new fish yet!

Lack of aeration does not hit all fish equally (unless it is really severe). It isn't unusual for some fish in a tank to die from that and not others.

However, it could also be that there is a disease issue and the small clown just hasn't gotten hit yet. It would be very unusual for a severe parasitic event to sweep through a tank and kill some fish but not others of the same species.

In a perfect world - after updating the aeration, you should wait 30 to 45 days before adding any new fish, and then only add properly quarantined fish.

I feel like this is a good plan and this is exactly what I will do. Add the skimmer and wait at least 6 weeks. Will likely do a series of large water changes. Is it fine to add coral during this time?

 

[Makaveli]

Hey everyone, so I am going to add the skimmer tomorrow and leave it as it is for 6 weeks at least. During this time, I will do a series of large water changes. However, is it fine to add coral during this time?

 

[Lavey29]

And stop adding tangs to a very small tank. If you choose to be in this hobby you have a moral obligation to provide a suitable environment for your fish.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I feel like this is a good plan and this is exactly what I will do. Add the skimmer and wait at least 6 weeks. Will likely do a series of large water changes. Is it fine to add coral during this time?

Well, I can't tell you if you tank is ready for corals or not, but unless the invertebrates come from a tank with untreated fish in it, it is ok to add them during this time.

 

[MnFish1]

Well, I can't tell you if you tank is ready for corals or not, but unless the invertebrates come from a tank with untreated fish in it, it is ok to add them during this time.

Jay - I have a question (or 2) - if the OP adds coral, as long as he/she leaves the tank fallow for 45-60 days, would it matter if there were fish in the original coral tank? If there is a disease, that doesn't manifest in the clown, is it possible that unless it's treated with the usual QT protocol, that it could affect future fish? Thanks!

 

[Makaveli]

This is where my confusion still sits.

1. Does fish disease lead to toxins in the water or does it die with the fish.

2. If the water is toxic, is it possible that the initial surviving clown could have built immunity?

3. If it's a disease and does not lead to water toxins, why do new additions keep dying?

 

[Makaveli]

This is where my confusion still sits.

1. Does fish disease lead to toxins in the water or does it die with the fish.

2. If the water is toxic, is it possible that the initial surviving clown could have built immunity?

3. If it's a disease and does not lead to water toxins, why do new additions keep dying?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Jay - I have a question (or 2) - if the OP adds coral, as long as he/she leaves the tank fallow for 45-60 days, would it matter if there were fish in the original coral tank? If there is a disease, that doesn't manifest in the clown, is it possible that unless it's treated with the usual QT protocol, that it could affect future fish? Thanks!

Sorry, in re-reading the thread, there is still a clownfish alive? Then the tank is NOT running fallow while that fish is still in there.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

This is where my confusion still sits.

1. Does fish disease lead to toxins in the water or does it die with the fish.

2. If the water is toxic, is it possible that the initial surviving clown could have built immunity?

3. If it's a disease and does not lead to water toxins, why do new additions keep dying?

Fish disease doesn't make the water toxic.

As explained ,the clownfish is infected with disease but has built immunity, so any new additions will catch disease from the clownfish.

While fish can build an immunity, new additions are stressed from being in the LFS then being transported to your home and then dumped in a new tank, its a horrible experience for them, so they don't have the strength at that particular time to fight off disease.

 

[Lavey29]

Fish disease doesn't make the water toxic.

As explained ,the clownfish is infected with disease but has built immunity, so any new additions will catch disease from the clownfish.

While fish can build an immunity, new additions are stressed from being in the LFS then being transported to your home and then dumped in a new tank, its a horrible experience for them, so they don't have the strength at that particular time to fight off disease.

If he has brook or velvet in the tank which is the most likely case then his last fish will succumb also in the near future. His immune system will only fight it off for so long. Saw it with my first 2 clowns.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

If he has brook or velvet in the tank which is the most likely case then his last fish will succumb also in the near future. His immune system will only fight it off for so long. Saw it with my first 2 clowns.

I assumed ich for some reason, not sure why, it wasn't mentioned.

But I didn't know fish couldn't build immunity to brook or velvet, thanks for correcting me.