Koran angel not doing well in QT

[Andyt2989]

Help!
I have had a Koran angel in QT for the last two weeks. QT had copper at 2.4 (copper safe measured with Hanna meter).
Fish was fine and eating well until today. Now he is flashing, swimming with weird jerky movements and not eating. Eyes are bulging and a bit cloudy, also he looks pale. No signs of any white spots, or tendency to seek out high flow areas.
Not sure what to do. Should I stop copper and start prazipro?

 

[vetteguy53081]

Help!
I have had a Koran angel in QT for the last two weeks. QT had copper at 2.4 (copper safe measured with Hanna meter).
Fish was fine and eating well until today. Now he is flashing, swimming with weird jerky movements and not eating. Eyes are bulging and a bit cloudy, also he looks pale. No signs of any white spots, or tendency to seek out high flow areas.
Not sure what to do. Should I stop copper and start prazipro?

Please provide video under white lighting of at least 20 seconds.
Have you tested ammonia and nitrate level?

 

[Andyt2989]

Thank you for your quick reply. Not sure how to do this, but trying to attach a short video and some pics.

 

[Andyt2989]

Thank you for your quick reply. Not sure how to do this, but trying to attach a short video and some pics.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is the Koran in a tank by itself? If so, I think you can be pretty sure that this is Neobenedenia flukes - the cloudy eyes, ragged fins and jerky swimming all point to that. The fin damage could be from a tankmate though.....

The trick is now, what to do? I don't like dosing copper and prazi at the same time, but sometimes you need to do just that. Some people give the fish a 5 minute FW dip to confirm flukes, but that entails extra handling stress.

One option is to go right into a series of Prazipro treatments - 3x, 8 days apart, with good aeration and a 25% water change (and re-copper the changed volume) three days after each treatment.

Another option: the fish has been in two weeks of copper. That will help eliminate Amyloodinium. Ich needs 30 days of copper, but you *could* go into hyposalinity, that handles ich and Neobendenia. It works better than prazi does on Neo. Trouble is, you need to hold the fish there for 35 days.


Here is an important risk you must understand: If the Neo infection is severe, when all of the flukes drop off, that leaves hundreds of holes in the fish's skin. Fish can bleed out and die from that. There is simply no work around for that, you just need to hope the infection isn't too severe.


Jay

 

[Andyt2989]

Is the Koran in a tank by itself? If so, I think you can be pretty sure that this is Neobenedenia flukes - the cloudy eyes, ragged fins and jerky swimming all point to that. The fin damage could be from a tankmate though.....

The trick is now, what to do? I don't like dosing copper and prazi at the same time, but sometimes you need to do just that. Some people give the fish a 5 minute FW dip to confirm flukes, but that entails extra handling stress.

One option is to go right into a series of Prazipro treatments - 3x, 8 days apart, with good aeration and a 25% water change (and re-copper the changed volume) three days after each treatment.

Another option: the fish has been in two weeks of copper. That will help eliminate Amyloodinium. Ich needs 30 days of copper, but you *could* go into hyposalinity, that handles ich and Neobendenia. It works better than prazi does on Neo. Trouble is, you need to hold the fish there for 35 days.


Here is an important risk you must understand: If the Neo infection is severe, when all of the flukes drop off, that leaves hundreds of holes in the fish's skin. Fish can bleed out and die from that. There is simply no work around for that, you just need to hope the infection isn't too severe.


Jay

Many thanks for the quick response and very helpful advice.

A freshwater dip confirmed the diagnosis of flukes.

I did a 100% water change and am now treating with both copper and Prazipro.

 

[Seanb1]

copper is hard on all fish if you ask me, i think its killed more fish than ich has.
i quit using it and did tank transfer method last 4 times buying fish and all my fish are doing great, never seen a white spot on them since doing it.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

copper is hard on all fish if you ask me, i think its killed more fish than ich has.
i quit using it and did tank transfer method last 4 times buying fish and all my fish are doing great, never seen a white spot on them since doing it.

Sorry, that isn’t true with Coppersafe. Hyposalinity is a good alternative treatment for ich, but I’ve treated many thousands of fish with Coppersafe and no losses from the copper itself.
Tank transfer also doesn’t work against Neobenedenia like in this case. That fluke has sticky eggs that get moved from tank to tank during TTM and the disease can restart if just one egg gets through.

Jay

 

[Andyt2989]

Quick update. The Angel is doing well, swimming normally and eating enthusiastically. One eye is still slightly bulging and a tiny bit cloudy - but much improved from yesterday.

Many thanks for the excellent advice.

 

[Andyt2989]

Just to let you know - this story has a happy ending. The patient made a full recovery, finished quarantine and is now happily installed in the display tank. So once again many thanks for all the help and excellent advice.