Inexpensive light for growing macro algae in display refugium? and Dosing?

[thoeffe]

I need suggestion on an inexpensive led light for growing macro algae in my display refugium 20 gallon high. I have some different species of caulerpa that grows very slowly. I would prefer them not being the red and blue grow lights because its a display tank. I just have an old cheap tube light that came with the tank and says for freshwater use only. =) The caulerpa has never gone sexual except the pieces I have transferred to my 55 gallon reef with mars aqua leds, it always goes sexual in there. Any clue why it wont grow in the 55, maybe just too new of a tank? Its only 4 months old. The 20 gallon is like a little ecosystem I don't really do anything to it besides RO top off occasionally. But id like to grow the grape caulerpa a bit faster so I can eat it. I also have chaetomorpha in it and it wont grow at all, besides odd growth spurts that have occurred twice in the past 6 years. Other than that it just makes a mess of fragmented chaeto pieces over the sand bed, its kind of annoying and thought about getting rid of it, but maybe better lights would help it too. The tank doesn't have any detectable nitrate, nitrites, or ammonia(probs absorbed as soon as they are available). Calcium levels are fine. Its loaded with hitchiker snails, white sponges and other inverts, coraline on back and side walls. Do you think I should dose it with anything or maybe feed it a bit heavier? I saw a post online (melevs reef website) about Cree led daylight bulbs 800lumens 5k 60watt or 100 watt equivalent. Are these really any good or would you recommend something else? I know nothing about light spectrum and don't want anything that could fuel nuisance algae growth along with macro algae if that's even a thing. Not sure if a dialed in spectrum can prevent one and promote the other or if all algae benefit from the same spectrum.

 

[BoomCorals]

Sounds like the light you have now is working decent. Doesn't matter if it says for freshwater only. Plants are plants. But, if you want something cheap and a bit brighter you can get some utility light reflectors and compact fluorescents from Home Depot or similar. Just shoot for buying the daylight bulb 6500k or higher. Nothing fancy but they are cheap and will get the job done.

I use a Kessil over my display refugium.

 

[Subsea]

For fast growing Caulerpa 5000 kelvin is best. For viewing, 6500 kelvin is pleasing with crisp Red,Yellow and green reflected back.

With respect to LED colors: White is composed of red, green & blue. Two of those three spectrum are the most photosynthetic active spectrum. Even when light is not in the most active spectrum, it is still being utilized but not as efficiently.

 

[lapin]

I have a small LED grow light I purchased @ the hardware store. It has std base and I got a aluminum cone reflector for it. I have red macro growing under it. This is over my external overflow in a basket. Its about 12" deep . The light is very normal white looking, not that red blue spots in the eye effect.
My 20 gallon fuge has the viperspectra 300 w grow light. Its the cheap model ( no dimmer). Its 18" over the water. The macro grows great under it . My issue is I had ulva in there with my red macros. Now once a week I have to pull out hand fulls of ulva so the reds on the bottom get enough light. It does have a clean white look in the water but if you are lower than it you see those red and blue spots.

 

[Subsea]

I have a small LED grow light I purchased @ the hardware store. It has std base and I got a aluminum cone reflector for it. I have red macro growing under it. This is over my external overflow in a basket. Its about 12" deep . The light is very normal white looking, not that red blue spots in the eye effect.
My 20 gallon fuge has the viperspectra 300 w grow light. Its the cheap model ( no dimmer). Its 18" over the water. The macro grows great under it . My issue is I had ulva in there with my red macros. Now once a week I have to pull out hand fulls of ulva so the reds on the bottom get enough light. It does have a clean white look in the water but if you are lower than it you see those red and blue spots.

Ulva is the fastest grower I have seen. In most cases, it does not attach, so I maximize growth using an air tumble culture. It will shade anything in the tank. For maximizing production, I do mono culture tanks.

Don’t eat too much today my brother.

 

[lapin]

Ulva is the fastest grower I have seen. In most cases, it does not attach, so I maximize growth using an air tumble culture. It will shade anything in the tank. For maximizing production, I do mono culture tanks.
Don’t eat too much today my brother.

Mono culture. As in a lot of separate tanks? So how many do you have over there? I should come over and count them some time. Ill bring a pencil and paper.
Eat eat eat. Its only the 2 of us so we made only 2 pies. You have a great T day.

 

[Subsea]

Mono culture. As in a lot of separate tanks? So how many do you have over there? I should come over and count them some time. Ill bring a pencil and paper.
Eat eat eat. Its only the 2 of us so we made only 2 pies. You have a great T day.

I should post “too many tanks thread”. In preparation for winter, I just emptied three 150G above ground tanks from outdoor mariculture and maxed out volumes on in ground tanks. Inside, includes eight tanks. I am in process to document power consumption of production tanks to determine cost effectiveness of systems. Bring your pencil & paper.

 

[thoeffe]

Should I be looking for any other specs on the bulbs like par or lumens or anything?

 

[Subsea]

I need suggestion on an inexpensive led light for growing macro algae in my display refugium 20 gallon high. I have some different species of caulerpa that grows very slowly. I would prefer them not being the red and blue grow lights because its a display tank. I just have an old cheap tube light that came with the tank and says for freshwater use only. =) The caulerpa has never gone sexual except the pieces I have transferred to my 55 gallon reef with mars aqua leds, it always goes sexual in there. Any clue why it wont grow in the 55, maybe just too new of a tank? Its only 4 months old. The 20 gallon is like a little ecosystem I don't really do anything to it besides RO top off occasionally. But id like to grow the grape caulerpa a bit faster so I can eat it. I also have chaetomorpha in it and it wont grow at all, besides odd growth spurts that have occurred twice in the past 6 years. Other than that it just makes a mess of fragmented chaeto pieces over the sand bed, its kind of annoying and thought about getting rid of it, but maybe better lights would help it too. The tank doesn't have any detectable nitrate, nitrites, or ammonia(probs absorbed as soon as they are available). Calcium levels are fine. Its loaded with hitchiker snails, white sponges and other inverts, coraline on back and side walls. Do you think I should dose it with anything or maybe feed it a bit heavier? I saw a post online (melevs reef website) about Cree led daylight bulbs 800lumens 5k 60watt or 100 watt equivalent. Are these really any good or would you recommend something else? I know nothing about light spectrum and don't want anything that could fuel nuisance algae growth along with macro algae if that's even a thing. Not sure if a dialed in spectrum can prevent one and promote the other or if all algae benefit from the same spectrum.

If you want more Grape Caulerpa for human consumption, put more watts into the tank.

As a generalization, fast growing macro is not as particular about spectrum as vendors would have you think, meaning it will use what you give it. Since it is a display refugium, make it pleasing to your eyes. For me, 5000 Kevin to 10,000 Kevin is pleasing.

I saw one thread you posted with a picture showing your 55G next to your 20G high. On this thread, you mentioned your Chaeto not growing in your 55G and marginally growing in your 20G. In both cases, I can tell you that you are nutrient limited. While it may be true that lighting could be more intense, photosynthesis is not limited by the most abundant nutrient but by the least abundant nutrient. You can increase your lighting but without sufficient nutrients to grow desirable macro, your display will grow undesirable algae that are more opportunistic.

As a generalization, macro absorbs carbon:nitrogenhosphorus in 560:30:1 ratio. Carbon enters water thru carbon dioxide using photosynthesis to form glucose, which is carbon for the tank. Food brings in all of those components including iron. Iron is most often a limiting nutrient and is easy to dose.

If you are serious about growing editable macro in your 20G high get a 160W black box led that will fit over your 20G tank. After you have the light, feed your tank. Macro needs nutrients to grow.

I see where you bought a HOB protein skimmer for your 55G tank. I have been skimmerless for 35 years. Aside from gas exchange, I see little point to protein skimmer. It will grow nothing. It will remove nutrients from the water. If you do a proper test of your water parameters, I think you will find that you are nutrient limited in both tanks. Instead of spending money on HOB protein skimmer, I would have bought a 300W black box light and moved one of the two 165W from your 55 to the 20.

https://www.amazon.com/MarsAqua-Dim...words=mars+aqua+300w&psc=1&smid=AKPEMWWZ95494

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_...&sprefix=mars+aqua+,aps,171&crid=DMARYWT1GNBD

If the above is too much money, then you should cram as many 5000K PAR 38 lamps at 15w that you can fit over your 20G, available at Home Depot.

 

[thoeffe]

If you want more Grape Caulerpa for human consumption, put more watts into the tank.

As a generalization, fast growing macro is not as particular about spectrum as vendors would have you think, meaning it will use what you give it. Since it is a display refugium, make it pleasing to your eyes. For me, 5000 Kevin to 10,000 Kevin is pleasing.

I saw one thread you posted with a picture showing your 55G next to your 20G high. On this thread, you mentioned your Chaeto not growing in your 55G and marginally growing in your 20G. In both cases, I can tell you that you are nutrient limited. While it may be true that lighting could be more intense, photosynthesis is not limited by the most abundant nutrient but by the least abundant nutrient. You can increase your lighting but without sufficient nutrients to grow desirable macro, your display will grow undesirable algae that are more opportunistic.

As a generalization, macro absorbs carbon:nitrogenhosphorus in 560:30:1 ratio. Carbon enters water thru carbon dioxide using photosynthesis to form glucose, which is carbon for the tank. Food brings in all of those components including iron. Iron is most often a limiting nutrient and is easy to dose.

If you are serious about growing editable macro in your 20G high get a 160W black box led that will fit over your 20G tank. After you have the light, feed your tank. Macro needs nutrients to grow.

I see where you bought a HOB protein skimmer for your 55G tank. I have been skimmerless for 35 years. Aside from gas exchange, I see little point to protein skimmer. It will grow nothing. It will remove nutrients from the water. If you do a proper test of your water parameters, I think you will find that you are nutrient limited in both tanks. Instead of spending money on HOB protein skimmer, I would have bought a 300W black box light and moved one of the two 165W from your 55 to the 20.

https://www.amazon.com/MarsAqua-Dim...words=mars+aqua+300w&psc=1&smid=AKPEMWWZ95494

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_2_10?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=mars+aqua+165w&sprefix=mars+aqua+,aps,171&crid=DMARYWT1GNBD

If the above is too much money, then you should cram as many 5000K PAR 38 lamps at 15w that you can fit over your 20G, available at Home Depot.

Ideally the goal is to learn how to run a tank without a skimmer and not have to do tones of water changes. When it comes to knowledge I don't think I have quite enough to do that yet. I had hair algae problems in my 20 gallon high which is now gone but it took a few years of feeding little and I'm guessing the caulerpa takes up all the nutrients now, idk the tank just kind of found a balance. I started seeing hair algae in my 55 and started doing water changes 5 gallons twice a week and didn't want to repeat the 20 gallon hair algae issue on a larger scale so just broke down and bought the skimmer haven't received it yet though. Am I understanding you correctly that I have to provide higher amounts of nutrients for the macro to get going in the 55 gallon and that I probs am lacking a nutrient like iron which the hair algae doesn't need as high quantities of so it is able to grow whereas the caulerpa is not. What test kits should I have? I just bought salifert alk, calc, magn, and have API pH, phos, nitrate that I have had from my 20 gallon. Anyways, early this morning I bought a cree LED bulb, none of there bulbs listed the par besides a super small "grow bulb" that said only 11 par and had very little wattage and thought the cree bulb would be better than that.View attachment 899402 View attachment 899403

 

[thoeffe]

 

[Subsea]

Ideally the goal is to learn how to run a tank without a skimmer and not have to do tones of water changes. When it comes to knowledge I don't think I have quite enough to do that yet. I had hair algae problems in my 20 gallon high which is now gone but it took a few years of feeding little and I'm guessing the caulerpa takes up all the nutrients now, idk the tank just kind of found a balance. I started seeing hair algae in my 55 and started doing water changes 5 gallons twice a week and didn't want to repeat the 20 gallon hair algae issue on a larger scale so just broke down and bought the skimmer haven't received it yet though. Am I understanding you correctly that I have to provide higher amounts of nutrients for the macro to get going in the 55 gallon and that I probs am lacking a nutrient like iron which the hair algae doesn't need as high quantities of so it is able to grow whereas the caulerpa is not. What test kits should I have? I just bought salifert alk, calc, magn, and have API pH, phos, nitrate that I have had from my 20 gallon. Anyways, early this morning I bought a cree LED bulb, none of there bulbs listed the par besides a super small "grow bulb" that said only 11 par and had very little wattage and thought the cree bulb would be better than that.View attachment 899402 View attachment 899403

You should measure nitrate & phosphate. While iron is not considered a major nutrient with the big three (nitrogen/phosphorus/potassium) iron depletion will limit the growth of both macro and coral. I dose iron once a week. In an article that @Randy Holmes-Farley wrote on iron dosing, I gathered that it would be hard to overdose iron. The artice indicated how macro could absorb & store iron during times of excess and use it when required. I dosed a 55G tumble culture of Red Gracilaria. Within 24/hours I saw a vibrant color change to dark red. Within four days, I saw accerated growth and extra surface growth which later proved to be iron storage along side main stem.

If you are unsure of your test results have a local full service fish store run test to verify your results. If that is not available, I get a regional agriculture lab to run my test results.

https://www.wardlab.com/water-services.php

INDIVIDUAL WATER ANALYSIS
Aluminum .......................... $5.50
Ammonium ........................ $6.50
Boron................................. $6.00
Carbonate/Bicarbonate...... $8.00
Chloride ............................. $6.00
Copper............................... $6.50
Fluoride.............................. $6.00

Hardness ........................... $6.50
Iron .................................... $6.50
Iron Bacteria (8 day)......... $19.25
Manganese........................ $6.50
Nitrite ................................. $5.50
Ortho Phosphorus ............. $6.00
pH...................................... $5.50

Silica.................................. $6.00
Total Dissolved Solids ....... $8.00
Total Nitrogen.................... $6.50
Total Phosphorus .............. $6.00
Total Suspended Solids..... $8.00
Zinc.................................... $6.50

Carbon enters the water as carbon dioxide, then combines with carbonate alkalinity to form bicarbonate which when coupled with photosynthesis forms glucose which is organic carbon. You should measure alkalinity and dose kalk to raise alkalinity.