Help with camera body decision and possible future lens limitations

newbreefer316 · Dec 10, 2017

I've done a little research, but barely scratched the surface with as much as there is out there, and think I'm about ready for a little hands on time but I'm looking for a little bit of general guidance before picking up my first camera.

I'll start off with the fact that I'm a hobbyist and looking for a camera that can also be easily used to capture moments with the family.

That being said I'm leaning towards a mirror-less 4/3 body for the smaller package. With the camera only being part of the equation, does the body choice I'm looking at limit me when it comes to eventually getting a decent/good f2.8 macro lens? Are there any brands to lean towards or stay away from, based on usability and lens compatibility? I'm looking to spend up to $500 for the body and that puts me in the sony a6000, canon eos m100 and olympus omd range.

ChrisRD · Dec 10, 2017

There is some amazing Micro 4/3 gear these days and the system certainly won't limit you...plenty of fast glass, good flash system, etc. I tried Olympus for a while but couldn't get used to the small size (even though the IQ and functionality was excellent)...and ended going back to Canon mostly because I'm very comfortable with that system (I have shot Canon gear as far back as film in the 80s). I will definitely miss the in-body IS system on the Oly...works great.

I found the Olympus single-shot AF (using the OM-D EM-10 Mark II) to be very fast/accurate and the eye/fast tracking was great. They have a whole line of relatively inexpensive prime lenses that are F/1.8. I've tried the 17, 25 and 45mm and all were extremely sharp and well built. They have a 60mm/2.8 macro that is very good. The 45/1.8 is extremely good...nice bokeh...perfect for kid/family snaps and portraits. The tracking AF on the Oly was not as good...not dSLR territory but not terrible. The video AF was a bit annoying...it would consistently hunt in/out. I mostly just used manual focus for video with the kids as I got tired of the hunting. I think this is better on the more advanced Oly bodies...also might be better on Panasonic (and Pany / Oly lenses are interchangeable)...no experience with those.

If you're into shooting video you might want to consider the Canon M system...the dual-pixel AF excels at video (no hunting like contrast-detect systems). The problem with Canon's mirrorless system is the lack of lenses. Unless you're willing to get the adapter and go to larger EF or EF-S glass the options are very limited. Using the adapter and the larger glass sorta defeats the purpose of the compact M4/3 system IMO. If you're going to do that, IMO it might make mores sense to just go for compact SLR like their SL2. Then you can use EF and EF-S glass with no adapter...and it's still fairly compact...and also has the dual-pixel AF for video shooting. The catch with Canon's video system is that you need IS in the lens if you want it...no in-body IS (at least not for still pics...they're now starting to use a pixel-shift type IS for video in some of their newest bodies...but it's not as effective as the sensor-shift types like Oly/Pany/Sony).

I don't know much about Sony...but their mirrorless bodies do seem to be excellent. The main complaint people seem to have with them is useability...i.e. complex / non-intuitive menus, too many bells-n-whistles. etc. Their native lens selection is not the greatest either....although there are a lot of good third-party manufacturer's making glass for their mount. ..which probably helps mitigate that. From what I have seen their AF performance is very good...sensor/IQ performance also.

Whatever you do, you might consider buying some quality used gear if you're on a limited budget...your $$$ will go a lot further. If you're interested in Canon stuff there is a ton of used gear at FredMiranda.com in the B&S forum and prices on a lot of that stuff have really bottomed-out in recent years. You could pick-up a good body and nice 100mm/2.8 macro for cheap. They have other brands too Nikon, Sony, Oly, Pany, etc....just don't know the other gear as well as I know Canon.

Sorry, I know that was a lot...just sorta poured out...LOL

Best of luck with whatever gear you decide on!

newbreefer316 · Dec 10, 2017

ChrisRD said:
There is some amazing Micro 4/3 gear these days and the system certainly won't limit you...plenty of fast glass, good flash system, etc. I tried Olympus for a while but couldn't get used to the small size (even though the IQ and functionality was excellent)...and ended going back to Canon mostly because I'm very comfortable with that system (I have shot Canon gear as far back as film in the 80s). I will definitely miss the in-body IS system on the Oly...works great.

I found the Olympus single-shot AF (using the OM-D EM-10 Mark II) to be very fast/accurate and the eye/fast tracking was great. They have a whole line of relatively inexpensive prime lenses that are F/1.8. I've tried the 17, 25 and 45mm and all were extremely sharp and well built. They have a 60mm/2.8 macro that is very good. The 45/1.8 is extremely good...nice bokeh...perfect for kid/family snaps and portraits. The tracking AF on the Oly was not as good...not dSLR territory but not terrible. The video AF was a bit annoying...it would consistently hunt in/out. I mostly just used manual focus for video with the kids as I got tired of the hunting. I think this is better on the more advanced Oly bodies...also might be better on Panasonic (and Pany / Oly lenses are interchangeable)...no experience with those.

If you're into shooting video you might want to consider the Canon M system...the dual-pixel AF excels at video (no hunting like contrast-detect systems). The problem with Canon's mirrorless system is the lack of lenses. Unless you're willing to get the adapter and go to larger EF or EF-S glass the options are very limited. Using the adapter and the larger glass sorta defeats the purpose of the compact M4/3 system IMO. If you're going to do that, IMO it might make mores sense to just go for compact SLR like their SL2. Then you can use EF and EF-S glass with no adapter...and it's still fairly compact...and also has the dual-pixel AF for video shooting. The catch with Canon's video system is that you need IS in the lens if you want it...no in-body IS (at least not for still pics...they're now starting to use a pixel-shift type IS for video in some of their newest bodies...but it's not as effective as the sensor-shift types like Oly/Pany/Sony).

I don't know much about Sony...but their mirrorless bodies do seem to be excellent. The main complaint people seem to have with them is useability...i.e. complex / non-intuitive menus, too many bells-n-whistles. etc. Their native lens selection is not the greatest either....although there are a lot of good third-party manufacturer's making glass for their mount. ..which probably helps mitigate that. From what I have seen their AF performance is very good...sensor/IQ performance also.

Whatever you do, you might consider buying some quality used gear if you're on a limited budget...your $$$ will go a lot further. If you're interested in Canon stuff there is a ton of used gear at FredMiranda.com in the B&S forum and prices on a lot of that stuff have really bottomed-out in recent years. You could pick-up a good body and nice 100mm/2.8 macro for cheap. They have other brands too Nikon, Sony, Oly, Pany, etc....just don't know the other gear as well as I know Canon.

Sorry, I know that was a lot...just sorta poured out...LOL

Best of luck with whatever gear you decide on!

Thanks for the detailed information. Definitely some jewels in there that I will look into. To completely dumb it down, if I was to walk into a Best Buy today and look for a Canon camera, which would you recommend? I'm confused with all the different EOS levels... SL2, t6, t6i etc... It seems like going with something a little more versatile, both capabilities and compatibility, plus potentially a larger aftermarket/used pool of equipment would be well worth the larger frame.

ChrisRD · Dec 10, 2017

It's largely going to come down to your preferences...i would just check some out in a local store and see which bodies you like. Typically as the bodies get more advanced there are more manual control options available without having to dig into menus...and the phase-detect (through the lens) AF tends to get more sophisticated (i.e. more focus points, more customization options, etc.).

Honestly, I think anything in the Rebel lineup will be good value. If you're interested in the camera doing double-duty for family video I recommend getting a model that has the dual-pixel AF. For tank/macro photos any of them will work great...just pickup a decent macro lens. You can use extension tubes as a cheaper alternative to get "macro" capability out of non-macro lenses, but the downside is you have a very limited working depth (i.e. the area in which you can get things into focus is fairly narrow).

The bodies tend to depreciate quickly...and people tend to upgrade a lot...so there is a huge used market for this stuff. If you buy used you can shoot with the body for a while and when you outgrow it you can sell it and upgrade to something more advanced for limited investment. I would put more of your budget toward quality lenses...they hold their value better and will have a larger impact on your image quality.

HTH