Giesemann Matrixx II T5 Fixture

[Reefahholic]

Does anybody know why they discontinued this fixture. I remember reading about it somewhere but I can’t remember what it was. I know this is an older fixture, but a friend of mine has one and I was thinking about running it.

Also, since ATI and Giesemann are both German I believe, does anybody know which fixture is more powerful (excluding the powermodule). Does the 8 lamp ATI run off of about the same wattage or power? Thx.

 

[rtparty]

The Gmann T5 fixtures were never cooled properly and it killed their PAR and electronics. The Sunpower puts out more PAR because of the cooling

 

[Reefahholic]

The Gmann T5 fixtures were never cooled properly and it killed their PAR and electronics. The Sunpower puts out more PAR because of the cooling

So I’m guessing that’s why they discontinued it?

I thought ATI Sunpower was also made in Germany?

 

[rtparty]

So I’m guessing that’s why they discontinued it?

I thought ATI Sunpower was also made in Germany?

I assume they discontinued it from lack of sales. If it couldn’t sell well when T5s were popular, it certainly won’t sell when bulbs are nearly impossible to get.

I’m 99% sure both are made in Germany but they are completely different designs. Giesemann never conceded that cooling T5s was super important. They were all about form over function even to the detriment of their products.

 

[Reefahholic]

I assume they discontinued it from lack of sales. If it couldn’t sell well when T5s were popular, it certainly won’t sell when bulbs are nearly impossible to get.

I’m 99% sure both are made in Germany but they are completely different designs. Giesemann never conceded that cooling T5s was super important. They were all about form over function even to the detriment of their products.

Ok that makes sense. The form is definitely nice. Man, I had a feeling bulbs are hard to get now. Are they impossible to get or just getting very slim. Who is still selling T5 bulbs? About 5 yrs ago I noticed they were already getting slim. There was this one company that had them all (forgot the name), but one day they just went out of business or stopped selling them. After that I started buying from BRS and Aquarium Specialty. They were the only two that had constant stock and not always sold out.

 

[ナイトコア猫]

So I’m guessing that’s why they discontinued it?

I thought ATI Sunpower was also made in Germany?

There are fewer people using T5 now, so discontinuation is inevitable.

 

[Reefahholic]

There are fewer people using T5 now, so discontinuation is inevitable.

It happens, but they’re not gone yet.

 

[ナイトコア猫]

It happens, but they’re not gone yet.

I thought those T5 ones were very good, but I knew they were going to be discontinued soon, so I bought LED strips. Is there any way to make a long LED strip in the shape of a T5 tube that can be installed in a T5 light stand? This kind of lamp holder can at least continue to be used. If there is such a product, at least the T5 lamp holder does not need to be thrown away. Some of those T5 lamp holders are really well made.

 

[Rafik]

Your idea about an LED strip shaped like a T5 tube is brilliant! That way, we could continue using our existing T5 stands while enjoying the benefits of LED technology.

 

[rtparty]

I thought those T5 ones were very good, but I knew they were going to be discontinued soon, so I bought LED strips. Is there any way to make a long LED strip in the shape of a T5 tube that can be installed in a T5 light stand? This kind of lamp holder can at least continue to be used. If there is such a product, at least the T5 lamp holder does not need to be thrown away. Some of those T5 lamp holders are really well made.

This has been tried multiple times and always fails

 

[rtparty]

Ok that makes sense. The form is definitely nice. Man, I had a feeling bulbs are hard to get now. Are they impossible to get or just getting very slim. Who is still selling T5 bulbs? About 5 yrs ago I noticed they were already getting slim. There was this one company that had them all (forgot the name), but one day they just went out of business or stopped selling them. After that I started buying from BRS and Aquarium Specialty. They were the only two that had constant stock and not always sold out.

They are still out there. I believe BRS is still carrying what they can get. My sources have told me some of the last runs have already been produced and production is being shut down in Europe. It will be up to the companies to move factories out of Europe if they want to keep producing them. Despite what people say, the hobby will not provide enough business to keep the factories open just to make some specialty bulbs. See T12 VHO for an example of what’s going to happen

 

[jda]

T12 VHO are still being made. You can call uvlco and ask. Champion, Premium still sell them or you can order larger quantities directly from UVL. More people use these than many think. UVL is an example of how a small niche can still provide more than enough business to one or two small companies. They also make tanning bed bulbs, but not reptile which helps other T5 bulb makers.

ATI nor Giesemann have any plans to stop making T5 bulbs. Anything can change. Like I have said 1000 times before, go to real reefing sites and not BRS who want to sell their own brands. Our LFS stock a full line of ATI bulbs in all lengths. Anybody have any idea how popular T5 fixtures are in Europe? I called and asked them when Radium and Ushio shifted their business. They are like UVL and can make plenty just on this hobby... but they make a few other kinds of bulbs too. The biggest issue has been delays in shipping to the US sometimes. The Trump tariff phase was not helpful, for one, but there have been others.

The Giesemann fixtures are fine - take the glass/plexi out of them and let some heat out if you think that it matters. More PAR gets through anyway without the covers. Most probably won't even be able to tell the difference between these and ATI with even a normal fan blowing over the top of the tank. I have some AquaMedic fixtures that are supposed to be lower output too and they are the same PAR as a ATI PowerModule. I don't really use T5s so I don't really care, but I think that most of this is overblown by a test or two that was probably a bit biased.

LED in the shape of T5 does not work, or at least has not yet. You can kinda do this for general lighting, but without lenses, diffusers, etc. they just look weird and do not spread or cover well enough. To make this work, the LEDs take more power, which of course nobody needs. This is one reason why LED, T5, T8, T12 all are still on the approved list for speciality purposes... there is no substitute, at least yet.

 

[Reefahholic]

It’s tempting…I miss my T5’s, but no complaints with my current lighting.

I just got lucky and got some new 250w Radium’s from a friend. So we’ll see.

 

[jda]

With that particular model, you might lose a bit of output from the small reflectors moreso than any heat. The Giesemann that I have is 4 bulb and it has much larger reflectors similar to the AquaMedic or the ATI of the same size.

I don't think that it amounts to enough not to use it. I doubt that it is even 5%, if that much. I would use it - I bet that it looks nice too. Sometimes, those skinnier units have less spill into the room than the wider units.

To be fair, I have a Apogee 510 and I only tested the few T5s that I have laying around unused, some VHOs and a few hydroponics units. A watt is a watt, for the most part. VHOs on good reflectors are twice the input wattage, but also twice the output. I know that VHOs were tested by somebody to have less output, but they had no reflectors in the test. Overdriven T5 on IceCap ballasts match the output to the input. Dirty covers and covers at all impact things more than anything - cheap hydroponics fixture without glass or plexi has about the same output as a ATI with a cover on it, but I have no idea how long the bulbs last.

 

[Reefahholic]

cheap hydroponics fixture without glass or plexi has about the same output as a ATI with a cover on it, but I have no idea how long the bulbs last.

I always wondered how they would stack up.

That was why I was asking the difference between ATI and Giesemann. I figured if you looked at what was driving them you’d be able to calculate which has more PAR.

For example, the PowerModule comes with a big separate driver, but that may be for the LED’s. I never really thought about it much or looked to see what it was powering.

Maybe all the T5 fixtures run a similar power supply.

 

[bandando]

This is mine, 8x39 T5 Giesemann

 

[oreo54]

Heat and t5's..

 

[Rafik]

Your point about the PowerModule's driver makes sense. I hadn't really considered that the driver might be powering something other than the LEDs. It's definitely something to look into further.

 

[MartinM]

Not sure why everyone thinks T5 bulbs are difficult to get? Hasn't been a problem for me, Giesemann and ATI still sell their full collection, plus there are lots of horticulture bulbs made in the spectrums we want. I also use some reptile bulbs for the true UV. There's a great selection of T5!

 

[MartinM]

T12 VHO are still being made. You can call uvlco and ask. Champion, Premium still sell them or you can order larger quantities directly from UVL. More people use these than many think. UVL is an example of how a small niche can still provide more than enough business to one or two small companies. They also make tanning bed bulbs, but not reptile which helps other T5 bulb makers.

ATI nor Giesemann have any plans to stop making T5 bulbs. Anything can change. Like I have said 1000 times before, go to real reefing sites and not BRS who want to sell their own brands. Our LFS stock a full line of ATI bulbs in all lengths. Anybody have any idea how popular T5 fixtures are in Europe? I called and asked them when Radium and Ushio shifted their business. They are like UVL and can make plenty just on this hobby... but they make a few other kinds of bulbs too. The biggest issue has been delays in shipping to the US sometimes. The Trump tariff phase was not helpful, for one, but there have been others.

The Giesemann fixtures are fine - take the glass/plexi out of them and let some heat out if you think that it matters. More PAR gets through anyway without the covers. Most probably won't even be able to tell the difference between these and ATI with even a normal fan blowing over the top of the tank. I have some AquaMedic fixtures that are supposed to be lower output too and they are the same PAR as a ATI PowerModule. I don't really use T5s so I don't really care, but I think that most of this is overblown by a test or two that was probably a bit biased.

LED in the shape of T5 does not work, or at least has not yet. You can kinda do this for general lighting, but without lenses, diffusers, etc. they just look weird and do not spread or cover well enough. To make this work, the LEDs take more power, which of course nobody needs. This is one reason why LED, T5, T8, T12 all are still on the approved list for speciality purposes... there is no substitute, at least yet.

Lots of truth here.

But for LEDs, you can get some similar-to-T5-in-coverage offerings now (1st gen Straton, CoralCare's, and the ATI Blades).