Flukes I think...

[seafansar]

I just got a fairy wrasse today and noticed that one of his eyes is cloudy. I looked closely and it looked like a clear/white flatworm was attached to it. Thank god the fish is so easy going and let me catch it multiple times out of my 150 (I know, I know I should have quarantined!). I gave it a bath in Fluke-Tabs, but the thing wouldn't come off his eye. I finally took tweezers and got the thing. It would move every time I touched it! So gross! But I finally got it. He actually looked relieved after I removed it.

Anyway, his eye still looks a little cloudy and swollen. Should I assume he has more flukes or it was just that one that messed up his eye? Any other treatments besides Fluke-Tabs which didn't seem to work? Any good links to fluke treatment?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Azurel]

The eye could be cloudy from having it on him, I would keep an eye(no pun intended) on it just to make sure that he don't get a secondary infection to the eye. I would give him a good going over as flukes also like to get at the gills as well. Might want to treat with some stress-coat to help increase slime coat and I have read that a high Mag reading can help relive the pressure on the eye.....This is also a treatment in FW as well. It could also have been a predatory flatworm as well so who knows......Good luck with it.

 

[oceanparadise1]

Keep it in qt and I would repeat the bath at least once more

 

[Yellowtang]

I have found that freshwater dips to be quite good at removing flukes. After a freshwater dip I could see the flukes laying in the bottom of the dip container,

JR,

 

[seafansar]

Thanks for the replies!

I've decided that next time I see him, I'm going to catch him, give him a freshwater bath, and then put him in QT. I was an idiot and put him back in the tank after I removed the fluke/flatworm/whatever, cause he was soooo easy to catch. Well I guess he felt a whole lot better, cause instead of swimming at the surface like he was doing ever since I put him in the tank, he dove into the rocks and buried himself. I'm going to set up a QT tank tonight in hopes that I see him tomorrow.

He didn't look like he had more of them on him, so hopefully that was the only one.

Azurel- It did look like a flatworm. Do you have a link with pictures of predatory flatworms?

 

[oceanparadise1]

Plus 1 on the fresh water bath!

 

[stunreefer]

I have found that freshwater dips to be quite good at removing flukes. After a freshwater dip I could see the flukes laying in the bottom of the dip container

It is true that FW baths can knock off FWs, however it does NOT kill them, and it's very porbable that one, or many stay on the fish during the FW bath. Prazipro is the best way to treat for flukes (IME/IMO). It's easy, and very effective. It's not too hard on fish either assuming you do not over dose.

If there was a fluke on it's eye, I can almost gaurantee you there are more on the fish.

 

[Sikryd]

It is true that FW baths can knock off FWs, however it does NOT kill them, and it's very porbable that one, or many stay on the fish during the FW bath. Prazipro is the best way to treat for flukes (IME/IMO). It's easy, and very effective. It's not too hard on fish either assuming you do not over dose.

If there was a fluke on it's eye, I can almost gaurantee you there are more on the fish.

All of my new fish get this in QT as well. I also feed some gel type stuff that has meds in it. I forget the name right now though.
When my fish are in QT - the tank fish get the same food since I am too lazy to make up a 2nd batch of food at the same time.
I haven't had any issues and all of my fish are fat and happy.
QT is the only way to make sure you don't loose thousands from a $20-$100 fish, which sucks. I know from experience

 

[Yellowtang]

It is true that FW baths can knock off FWs, however it does NOT kill them, and it's very porbable that one, or many stay on the fish during the FW bath. Prazipro is the best way to treat for flukes (IME/IMO). It's easy, and very effective. It's not too hard on fish either assuming you do not over dose.

If there was a fluke on it's eye, I can almost gaurantee you there are more on the fish.

Freshwater dips do in fact KILL parasites, the parasites don't have osmotic regulators and can not stop absorbing fresh water into their cells, hence they explode. There are hundreds of pages on this under Googling for it....

JR,

PS Forgot to add the fish should also be quarantined, and medicated because the fish's own defense mechanism ie slime coat can also protect the parasite from the fresh water dip. The freshwater dip will eliminate a great majority of parasites and relieve some of the stress the fish is going thru and may then give the fish a better chance of surviving the medication..

 

[KEEPERZ]

has anyone confirmed Prazipro works inside an sps reef without hurting coral? I know someone who would like to run it but has coral concerns-

 

[stunreefer]

Freshwater dips do in fact KILL parasites, the parasites don't have osmotic regulators and can not stop absorbing fresh water into their cells, hence they explode. There are hundreds of pages on this under Googling for it....

Well, agree to disagree regarding flukes - no comment regarding parasites in general. We cannot rely solely on FW dips due to the different life cycles of flukes, which can lay eggs directly on the fish, substrate, aquarium, etc. At least, I will not rely on FW dips based on my personal experience along with many of my fellow angel nut reefer buddies.

PS Forgot to add the fish should also be quarantined, and medicated because the fish's own defense mechanism ie slime coat can also protect the parasite from the fresh water dip. The freshwater dip will eliminate a great majority of parasites and relieve some of the stress the fish is going thru and may then give the fish a better chance of surviving the medication..

Touche, well said.

I'm not saying do not FW dip, however that's only the first step I use to rid of flukes. Starts with a FW dip, then into a QT tank with LR and sand for grazing, then into a bare QT tank with PVC for treatment with Prazi and Cupramine (seachem copper med) if necessary.

Here's a great thread on flukes: Reef Central Online Community - Mysterious fish deaths are more common now (Flukes)

If you watch the "Fish Disease Treatment" forum on RC you will see threads on flukes pop up almost daily... here's another recent one: Reef Central Online Community - How to get rid of flukes and there eggs

There are hundreds more if necessary

Joe, someone posted in that second link I just posted regarding using Prazi in reef with no issues at all. Personally I have never used it in a reef.

 

[seafansar]

OMG, I think I'm going to start crying after reading the beginings of those Reef Central threads. The thing on my wrasse's eye looked exactly like this:

I tried to catch the wrasse for an hour today with no luck. I'm going to try a fish trap tomorrow.

Will skunk cleaner shrimp eat these things by any chance? What all will cleaner shrimp eat?! Seems like they won't eat any common parasites in the hobby.

 

[seafansar]

Ok I'm on page 5 now and am freaking out a little less now. The first thread says Prazipro works at killing the flukes and eggs AND several people have used it in their reef tanks with no ill affects to their SPS, LPS, zoas, or leathers. It does bother xenia and will make your skimmer go crazy.

My plan of action now is to catch that darn wrasse, put him in a 10 gallon with some prazipro, and keep him in there for ??? (haven't figured that one out yet, I need to re-read over a few things). If I see dead flukes in the QT, I'm going to watch my other fish very closely. If I see any signs of flukes on them too, I'm treating the tank with Prazipro (if my boyfriend will let me, I think he'd rather let all the fish die than have any of his corals die). Maybe I'll do a test run with a SPS I don't like that much and see how it reacts to the Prazipro.

Hopefully I can catch the wrasse tomorrow. I'm going to try the coke bottle trap with food in it and a slurp gun.

 

[seafansar]

has anyone confirmed Prazipro works inside an sps reef without hurting coral? I know someone who would like to run it but has coral concerns-

After reading all 10 pages of the RC thread, I think 5 people treated their reef tanks with Prazipro with no harm to the corals (except xenia) and 1 person lost 2 SPS frags and thought the treatment killed off his biological filtration (but mentioned that it might have been caused by something else and not the medicine).

QUOTE from my2rotties on pg. 8.

"In treated my entire reef system with Prazipro two weeks ago. It was very scary to do but I added it slowly over the course of 24 hours. Like the original poster mentioned my xenias were upset but survived. My LPS and SPS, inverts and anemones are just fine and every single fish survived the treatment and I had no losses. I did see flukes floating aound the water and fish that even looked healthy and fluke free were showing reactions to the prazipro. The colours became very vibrant and the fish are very happy. I just did not notice how bad they all were since it took some time to infest the tank and it occupants.

I would never tell anyone to go ahead with this treatment since perhaps I was just lucky with it. I will be treating my system one more time shortly just to be sure I got it all.

When I dosed it the first time, my fish were pooping so much it freaked me out. I don't know why this happened but wow was it ever a lot of poop, and my skimmer was shut off for treatment. When I did turn the skimmer on it was not happy, but it did not overflow on me at all. I have ball valved connected to it so I can dial it in or out for pick up.

For me it was worth the risk and I will do it again if needed. I did lose all my large angel prior to treatment due to a bacterial infection that might have set in when the flukes detached. They were the only fish I did end up losing, but a couple died prior to treatment and one died the day after I started. They one that died the following day was too far gone to help. I did find my angel had it the worst, but my porcupine puffer and picasso trigger were really bad too. The puffer had difficulties with breathing the first few hours but he is wonderful now. They are tough fish though and went through it very well.

Good luck with helping you fish. I decided to treat my entire system because I felt QT would help the fish for the time being but what would happen if they went back into the display. I had a small spike the following day but hardly anything at all."

 

[Sikryd]

I would do the FW dip first - then put it in the QT and add an airrator. The higher the O2 saturation the better.
Catching the wrasse is going to be a LOT HARDER than you think.
A good way to do it is use one of those clear specimen containers (for lack of the right term for it) - one of those containers that can hang on the side of your tank. Put some small rubble in the bottom (glue it if you can). Then put it in the corner of the tank and try and "chase" the wrasse towards that corner with some tongs or other non-net, poker kind of thing. This way it isn't too freaked out (I use my tongs so much my fish will eat from them) - but if I put a net in the tank they ALL go hide.
Putting some rubble in the container makes them think they have a place to hide and they will usually swim right in. Being that it is in the corner, you will be able to push it against the glass and slide it towards the top of the tank.
If you let off the glass too quick or move suddenly the fish will usually dart.
If you go slow, tilt it when you get to the top and raise it out of the water slowly, you usually won't even have to grab a net.
I have caught just about every fish I have, but the wrasses are a TOTALLY different fish when it comes to trying to catch them. ESPECIALLY after they know you are trying to catch them.
So your best bet is to try 1 time with the right equiptment.

Otherwise the only other solution I have found (besides for getting lucky with a fish trap) is to empty the tank real quick with a couple pumps (takes me 20min with a 150g stock tank), catch the fish, then fill it back up.

Good luck - I know how much of a bumber it is having a sick fish.
I QT everything - including inverts -

 

[Sikryd]

Since it is a Wrasse - I guess you could also freak it out so much it'll jump right out of the tank -
I had a Scott's that was afraid of his own shadow and would jump out if I walked into the room! lmaooo

 

[seafansar]

Thanks for the trap advice! Funny thing, my wrasse is a Scott's also. lol. He's really smart. I'd get close to trapping him in one spot and then he'd get smart and not go back to that spot again. I'll go to Petco tomorrow and see if they have a small rectangle betta bowl that I can use as a trap.

I hate it, he was sooooo easy to catch when he had that thing on his eye. I could catch him with my hand. Grrrrr....should have never put him back in. I thought at the time that the thing on his eye would be the only parasite on him. After reading about flukes, I highly doubt that was the only one.

 

[KEEPERZ]

thank you for the info /responses- still sounds dicey for in tank treatment but the stuff works-I hope more success stories roll in on the intank sps reef treatments moving forward.

 

[seafansar]

UPDATE:
I caught the wrasse yesterday amazingly enough. Chased him into a hole, my boyfriend held a net on the back side of the hole, and I squirted water and bubbles in the front side until it scared the wrasse back into the net.

Now he's in a little 10 gallon being treated with Prazipro. So far I haven't seen any flukes floating around in the water, but the white things on his fins are now gone. He still has a white spot on his side.

Someone asked in the RC fluke thread if flatworm exit would work to kill flukes, so I decided to test it. I gave him a 30 min bath in some water with FWE, but nothing happened. So either it takes more time or it doesn't work. I'm just going to stick with Prazipro for now.

I started a thread on RC to see how many people have used Prazipro in their reefs and so far have only gotten two responses. One saying that it will kill worms, but the person failed to state wether or not they actually used it themselves, and one person who used it in their mainly SPS reef with no problems and no worms dying. Here's a link:

Reef Central Online Community - Is Prazipro safe to use in a reef tank?

 

[stunreefer]

thank you for the info /responses- still sounds dicey for in tank treatment but the stuff works-I hope more success stories roll in on the intank sps reef treatments moving forward.

Joe, IMHO I would never dose any medication into my display tank.