Diluting Lanthanum?

[PotatoPig]

I’m hoping this is a simple question…

I’m trying to use a low and slow dose of lanthanum to keep phosphates stable. To do this I’m planning on diluting a small dose (3-5ml) in a 2 gallon jug, and then use as a part of my ATO water, so the dose in the ATO is something like 0.5ml/day or so.

I understand (maybe not fully) that one of the problems with this stuff is it can “stick” to things. But I’m not sure if it’s the lanthanum that sticks or the precipitate.

My concern - will the lanthanum stick to the inside of a plastic 2 gallon jug? Or does it need to bind with something in the water (which for RODI assume wouldn’t be an issue).

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Lanthanum will not stick to plastic jugs, and your dosing plan seems sound to me.

What exactly is the problem that a few folks have using lanthanum and fish is not apparent to me, but is not necessarily from it individually adhering to anything (like a gill surface) as opposed to particulate effects causing problems.

 

[PotatoPig]

Lanthanum will not stick to plastic jugs, and your dosing plan seems sound to me.

What exactly is the problem that a few folks have using lanthanum and fish is not apparent to me, but is not necessarily from it individually adhering to anything (like a gill surface) as opposed to particulate effects causing problems.

Thank you!

I’ve not had any problems either, and was a little surprised to see the nightmare stories after I was already using it! That said I also don’t have any of the fish types that seem more prone to issues with it.

In this case - I have my phosphates in the 0.1-0.2 range, and everything seems happy (LPS, Soft corals) but because this stuff takes phosphates out so quickly when dosed I’m trying this out to try approximately match the dose against phosphate production to avoid a sea-saw in parameters.

 

[Snoopy 67]

I ran 1ml/gallon in my top off water (30 gallon container).
Eventually I wound up @ 0.00 so I am now trying 0.5 ml/gal.
Phosphates went back to 0.05 after a week of plain RO topping off.
I'll know more next water change.

 

[Snoopy 67]

Drooped again to 0.04 after a week.
So now I'm trying 1ml/5 gallons.
Let you know more next week.

 

[Snoopy 67]

This week back up to 0.11.
I think I'll try dosing @ 1 ml/3 gallons because the vat is 30 gallons.
See you next time.

 

[Snoopy 67]

Ran the vat down to 2.5gallons & refilled @ 1ml/3 gallons.
PO4 up to 0.24 on this run.

 

[Snoopy 67]

New batch of RO made just before the water change so more next week.

 

[Snoopy 67]

OH WELL, still rising to 0.44
Let's try 1ml/ 2 gallons from here.

 

[Snoopy 67]

They say when you get older it's harder to remember.
BUT, there's an explanation - the older we get the more information we hold in the brain.
The more there is the longer it takes to retrieve it.
I've been somewhat off here trying to get this correct, ie, the brain kicked in.
I need a starting point to get it right instead of winging it.
So - dosing has brought me to 0.09, a good number to start at.
I'm now dosing @ 1ml/ 2 gallons. I'll have the results next week.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thanks for the update.

 

[Kriz]

@Randy Holmes-Farley @Snoopy 67
Can regular dosing of lanthanum cause negative effects? Cumulative effect?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley @Snoopy 67
Can regular dosing of lanthanum cause negative effects? Cumulative effect?

The concern with lanthanum dosing appears to relate to fish, especially tangs. I do not know why some folks suffer it and others do not.

 

[areefer01]

I’m hoping this is a simple question…

I’m trying to use a low and slow dose of lanthanum to keep phosphates stable. To do this I’m planning on diluting a small dose (3-5ml) in a 2 gallon jug, and then use as a part of my ATO water, so the dose in the ATO is something like 0.5ml/day or so.

I understand (maybe not fully) that one of the problems with this stuff is it can “stick” to things. But I’m not sure if it’s the lanthanum that sticks or the precipitate.

My concern - will the lanthanum stick to the inside of a plastic 2 gallon jug? Or does it need to bind with something in the water (which for RODI assume wouldn’t be an issue).

What lanthanum product did you use? I've been considering making up a batch of SeaKlear phosphate remover to finally address my 2.2 ppm phosphate level. I've used Phosphate Rx in the past to knock it down which works fine until it rebounds. GFO is exhausted too quickly so too messy, work, and not cost effective. Diluting LC for a limited daily dose over time seems appropriate to slowly lower safely with limited residue or particle mess. Hopefully not clog the filter sock too soon either.

I don't recall seeing a ratio for SeaKlear to say make up a gallon.

 

[PotatoPig]

What lanthanum product did you use? I've been considering making up a batch of SeaKlear phosphate remover to finally address my 2.2 ppm phosphate level. I've used Phosphate Rx in the past to knock it down which works fine until it rebounds. GFO is exhausted too quickly so too messy, work, and not cost effective. Diluting LC for a limited daily dose over time seems appropriate to slowly lower safely with limited residue or particle mess. Hopefully not clog the filter sock too soon either.

I don't recall seeing a ratio for SeaKlear to say make up a gallon.

I’m using the Tropic Marin product, with dosing based on the calculator here:

http://larryl.emailplus.org.user.fm/fish/dosing-instructions-phosphate-removers.html

Although since then my biome has apparently evolved and once I managed to dial phosphates down to 0.05-0.1 I saw my overall nutrients dive and now I’m struggling to keep them above zero…

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Snoopy 67]

Dropped from 0.24 to 0.13 using 0.75ml/gal.
Now comes a problem I will have to watch for.
I test right before my water change, then do my 5 gallon water change.
Next day testing dropped my level by another 50% to 0.06
Obviously that 5 gallons has an immediate effect on levels.
Looks like I'm on a roller coaster.

 

[Snoopy 67]

Last 2 tests were a nice surprise. I only dropped to 0.11 over the week and the next week saw me back @ 0.13.
I think I can live with that but, I test weekly, so we'll see.

 

[Snoopy 67]

From .13 to 0.09 in a week.
I'll stay here for a while & keep up the weekly testing.
Might have to "Fine Tune" a hair.

 

[Snoopy 67]

All of a sudden -0- appeared in the next test.
Back to the drawing board.

 

[Snoopy 67]

I decided to try using RO water without any lanthanum for my water changes.
I have a 12 gallon bucket with a top I'll use. ATO water is @ 0.6 concentration/gallon.
Know more in a week or so.