Deep Sand Bed

[Cstar_BC]

Looking to see if anyone has successfully kept a deep sand bed and has some suggestions .

I have a carpet anemone so need at least 4”

Now since we are mostly trying to mimic ocean conditions has anyone ever layered the sand

like 40% coarse crushed coral ,40% special grade and 20% sugar (bottom-up)

to me the biggest issues with DSB is the pockets of waste . I would assume this is from small sand particles binding together and becoming compacted where as larger particle sizes still allow space .

my plan is to have an army of conch/sand sifters blennies .

the tank is 240 gallon , 56l x33w

any tips welcome

Also I’ve looked into reduced sand beds and many people suggested a pvc pipe - my carpets foot is already the diameter of a side dinner plate so I think we are past that option

 

[New&no clue]

One of the LFS by me swears by a deep sand bed. Here is her write up on it.

Deep Sand Bed - AquaCorals Saltwater Reef Aquariums

Welcome to AquaCorals! The largest Tank Raised Soft Coral Aquaculture facility in the US! Over 100 Soft Coral species are grown on "Real Rock" here

www.aquacorals.com

 

[Miller535]

i point everyone interested in DSB's to this article. Dr. Shimek knows more about this topic then anyone. and he answers all to most of your questions.

Ron Shimek's Website...Deep Sand Beds

Dr Ron Shimek's Website - Information on animal groups, husbandry of coral reef aquarium animals, his passion for native Montana orchids, Ron's blog and online articles

www.ronshimek.com

 

[Webslinger]

There are better options than DSB without the risks. Your sugar will sink to the bottom and the course will move to the top.

 

[Miller535]

There are better options than DSB without the risks. Your sugar will sink to the bottom and the course will move to the top.

While I agree with you, that is how the sand should be according to Dr Shimek. It should be layered, NOT mixed, with sugar on the bottom.

 

[Webslinger]

Watch what snails/fish you put into the tank then. One wrasse would have the sand mixed up in a short time.

 

[fish farmer]

While I agree with you, that is how the sand should be according to Dr Shimek. It should be layered, NOT mixed, with sugar on the bottom.

I have never heard Dr. Shimek ever advocating layering the different grain sizes. The sandbed fauna would mix them up anyway in a properly functioning bed.

 

[Miller535]

I have never heard Dr. Shimek ever advocating layering the different grain sizes. The sandbed fauna would mix them up anyway in a properly functioning bed.

If you read the article that is exactly what he does, with a pie chart of percentages of different grain size. He has ALWAYS advocated for that.

 

[fish farmer]

Yes he advocates a mix of different size grains which I agree with, but I have never heard or saw in the article about putting it in LAYERS like small grains on the bottom, big on top or the other way around. Unless you are building a plenum style sand bed which calls for layers and a larger grain size.

20 years ago you could get oolitic play sand at Home Depot which was close to the preferred grain size for DSB construction at the time. Dr. Ron also told us to not rinse it either, just dump in your tank to a minimum depth of 4", add mixes of live sand and some micro fauna kits and let it mature.

 

[John08007]

20 years ago this is how i think all of us made our tanks. We had a plenium, i used eggcrate on the bottom of the tank, then gravel on top of that. The eggcrate made a larger amount of oxygen depleated water to break down nitrate. I've read in the last few years about people making remote dsb's using a 5 gal bucket. I have read about these crashing and taking out the tank.

 

[Miller535]

Yes he advocates a mix of different size grains which I agree with, but I have never heard or saw in the article about putting it in LAYERS like small grains on the bottom, big on top or the other way around. Unless you are building a plenum style sand bed which calls for layers and a larger grain size.

20 years ago you could get oolitic play sand at Home Depot which was close to the preferred grain size for DSB construction at the time. Dr. Ron also told us to not rinse it either, just dump in your tank to a minimum depth of 4", add mixes of live sand and some micro fauna kits and let it mature.

He does advocate it, even says you need the larger grain sand to hold the smaller grain size down. And if you have ever had a sanded of different grain sized sand, they would separate on their own with sugar sinking to the bottom.

 

[John Smith]

I have had my 120g 4x2x2 mixed for more than 10 years. Six years ago, I started DSB. 4" (1'x2') in the sump and 3" in the display tank (sugar fine sand) and have not changed my water since. Last year, I removed sand from the sump because I thought it was caking. I was wrong but since the sand was disturbed, I had to remove it and replace with rocks and coral fragments (3", 4", 5") up to water level. I like this better because I can now clean the sump with a power head. I still have not changed my water. PO4 is always zero on the Milwaukee Martini MI412, NO3 reads < .25 using Red Sea test kit. Every few months, I siphon the top layer of sand in the DT, clean and put it back in.

 

[Miller535]

He does advocate it, even says you need the larger grain sand to hold the smaller grain size down. And if you have ever had a sanded of different grain sized sand, they would separate on their own with sugar sinking to the bottom.

If you look at his pictures you can even see HIS tank layered with the "mud" at the bottom

 

[John Smith]

I should have mixed the sand with different size grains but I didn't.
I don't think you have to worry about pockets of waste. The microfauna will break down the waste. I have two strawberry conches. They will stir up the sand bed a little but most of the time will stay on the sand surface. I would not recommend keeping blennies. They sift foods out of the sand which defeats the purpose of having a DSB. Mine kept the sand very clean but ate all the microfauna in the sand bed within three months, stop sifting and then starve to death. I tried to feed him with small pellets it did not work. My sand bed is only 4'x2'x3". Yours has larger area and deeper. You might be okay. Start out with a small one, wait a few months before you add more. Another thing to consider, the sand sifter will keep the sand clean, there might not be enough algae for the conches to eat.

 

[Cstar_BC]

i point everyone interested in DSB's to this article. Dr. Shimek knows more about this topic then anyone. and he answers all to most of your questions.

Ron Shimek's Website...Deep Sand Beds

Dr Ron Shimek's Website - Information on animal groups, husbandry of coral reef aquarium animals, his passion for native Montana orchids, Ron's blog and online articles

www.ronshimek.com

Thank you this was very informative

There are better options than DSB without the risks. Your sugar will sink to the bottom and the course will move to the top.

unfortunately I need to cater to the carpet anemone and am just trying to see if there are multiple styles of having a DSB .

I should have mixed the sand with different size grains but I didn't.
I don't think you have to worry about pockets of waste. The microfauna will break down the waste. I have two strawberry conches. They will stir up the sand bed a little but most of the time will stay on the sand surface. I would not recommend keeping blennies. They sift foods out of the sand which defeats the purpose of having a DSB. Mine kept the sand very clean but ate all the microfauna in the sand bed within three months, stop sifting and then starve to death. I tried to feed him with small pellets it did not work. My sand bed is only 4'x2'x3". Yours has larger area and deeper. You might be okay. Start out with a small one, wait a few months before you add more. Another thing to consider, the sand sifter will keep the sand clean, there might not be enough algae for the conches to eat.

I am growing macro algae in the quarantine tank( caulerpa and gracilaria) so hopefully all algae eaters have an option for food.
Ideally I would like a balance of sand cleaners and microfauna . But it is definitely a hard middle road to follow

 

[BZOFIQ]

One of the few topics that get people all worked up because its their way or the highway.

See this

Deep Sand Beds still a thing?

Are they still practicable? I was thinking about throwing one in my sump. Do you have a DSB? Is it worth placing one in the sump? Right now I just run cheato- thinking of moving that to a reactor.

www.reef2reef.com

Than this

Is DSB crash just a myth?

I can't tell you how many times I've read warnings on discussion boards about deep sand beds (DSBs) risking a tank crash if the anaerobic layer is disturbed and toxic gases are released. I am beginning to think this is a myth. There is no good evidence for it and very few first-person...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Paulie069]

While I agree with you, that is how the sand should be according to Dr Shimek. It should be layered, NOT mixed, with sugar on the bottom.

Sugar????never herd of that please explain

 

[Miller535]

Sugar????never herd of that please explain

Sugar grain sand, it's kind of like a nickname for the really fine stuff like oolite.

 

[Cstar_BC]

One of the few topics that get people all worked up because its their way or the highway.

See this

Deep Sand Beds still a thing?

Are they still practicable? I was thinking about throwing one in my sump. Do you have a DSB? Is it worth placing one in the sump? Right now I just run cheato- thinking of moving that to a reactor.

www.reef2reef.com

Than this

Is DSB crash just a myth?

I can't tell you how many times I've read warnings on discussion boards about deep sand beds (DSBs) risking a tank crash if the anaerobic layer is disturbed and toxic gases are released. I am beginning to think this is a myth. There is no good evidence for it and very few first-person...

www.reef2reef.com

I have read a few of these posts but often times people aren’t using the DSB in the DT but rather a section in the sump.

now realistically I would think that a good mix of micro fauna and sand sifters are essential to keep micro fauna populations constantly reproducing as they never get large enough to exhaust their food source .

As well as the sand sifters getting rid of dead spots and turning over the sand - this introducing detritus etc to the lower levels through the stirring .

my logic anyway

 

[Jarret]

Looking to see if anyone has successfully kept a deep sand bed and has some suggestions .

I have a carpet anemone so need at least 4”

Now since we are mostly trying to mimic ocean conditions has anyone ever layered the sand

like 40% coarse crushed coral ,40% special grade and 20% sugar (bottom-up)

to me the biggest issues with DSB is the pockets of waste . I would assume this is from small sand particles binding together and becoming compacted where as larger particle sizes still allow space .

my plan is to have an army of conch/sand sifters blennies .

the tank is 240 gallon , 56l x33w

any tips welcome

Also I’ve looked into reduced sand beds and many people suggested a pvc pipe - my carpets foot is already the diameter of a side dinner plate so I think we are past that option

I had a long tentacled anemone (macrodactylis I think??) for about 9/10 years in a standard 6 foot 125 gal. Was pretty good size, foot was about 4 inches diameter and stretched up a good 8/9 inches probably. I ended up making a small acrylic box about 6/7 inches square, filling it about 90% with fine grain reef sand, then set the foot right on top of the sand. It eventually dug down to the bottom within a day. Lived there for many years till I sold it. Was cool cuz I could grab the box and move it if I needed to do some kind of tank maintenance etc... I kept it in a corner against the back and the over flow box and placed live rock in front to hide the container so it looked more natural. Not sure as to the carpet anemone, I would size up the animals current dimensions and tailor the box to fit.
Side story: I purchased said anemone along with a fluorescent pink carpet anemone when I first got into this hobby (1996). Typical noob, rookie story. Inexperienced. Bought animals I thought I had done enough research on but hadn’t. The carpet died 1 to 2 weeks later. Figured out later it had been injected with dye to make it more colorful. I placed the long tentacle under the brighter portion of the tank with compact fluorescents and it would “walk” over the span of a day or so to the opposite end of the tank which was only lit by regular fluorescents. I’d move it and it’d “walk” back over to the “dark side”. After the 3rd or 4th time, I figured it was going where it wanted to be. Plus I was tired of peeling the foot off the rock which is not the easiest.
Sorry for the long post