balling Aquaforest mineral salt into randy's 2 part diy magnesium

GSnake · May 12, 2024

The magnesium part of my diy needs to change if dosing Balling Part C or AF mineral salt. Much less is needed and the optimal recipe to make it is different.

Hi Randy,
this was quoted from you from an older thread about mixing mineral salt with calcium https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/balling-method-with-2-part-diy.908100/

since then, I have tried all for reef for a complete solution, which came up short on traces on my ICP as expected, and I've also tried a fauna marin Min S / Organic traces combo, but that also came up short or not detected at all for some traces. FM said Min S would reduce traces (a little counter intuitive) but the addition of Organic did not help as much as I wanted to bring trace levels up.

I now want go back and try Aquaforest balling, but with randy's DIY recipe. I am currently using the High PH method ( 1st solution - sodium hydroxide,2nd solution - cal chloride/ mag chloride) and am happy with the results, but want to move to a
1st solution - sodium hydroxide + component C (iodide/fluoride)
2nd solution- calcium chloride + component A (strontium/barium) + component B (various heavy metals)
3rd solution - mag chloride + mag sulfate + Aquaforest mineral salt + component K (potassium)

going back to the older style DIY, with the exception of sodium hydroxide, due to non mixability of reef mineral with calcium, (seems to be ok with magnesium alone though)

so what needs to be changed for the magnesium portion of the DIY to make it optimal ?
originally your DIY was almost 44x as strong as Aquaforests magnesium stock solution.

also I am assuming the component strong (ABCK) is compatible the DIY recipes..?

Thanks!
Avish

GSnake · May 13, 2024

sorry forgot to include what im currently using

sol 1: sodium hydroxide + sulfate
sol 2: calcium chloride + magnesium chloride

alternatively I can use reef mineral salt alone
what do I adjust to the above recipe (sulfate?) to incorporate sol 3 : reef mineral salt so its balanced?

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 14, 2024

If you use Balling Part C or the AF mineral salt, stop the sulfate and you will need to adjust the magnesium downward.

GSnake · May 14, 2024

ok ill remake my alk today without the sulfate. how do these companies come up with the mag needed (all for reef, aquaforest mg+mineral salt recipes) i found myself having to dose mg with all for reef. it seems ok with the jim walsh recipe im using above, balance wise, i think it might be better. but every system differs anyway, for mag at least right?

GSnake · May 14, 2024

can you help me clarify something before i go ahead and mix up stuff.

is it fair to substitute the sulfate portion of your recipe, with the AF mineral salt but in a separate container ( so 68.7g of mineral salt in this instance )

on the other hand, AF wants me to dose equal amounts of reef mineral salt with the amount of calcium dosed. AF calcium is 50% weaker than your recipe, so its fair to use 2x reef mineral salt when mixing a solution. this way i can use what I already have made. The magnesium portion seems to be 6.91x weaker than yours, but im not sure how to account for this and the extra mag chloride ions. subbing the sulfate amount seems reasonable to me, it is very similar in composition right? is there something im missing

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 14, 2024

GSnake said:
ok ill remake my alk today without the sulfate. how do these companies come up with the mag needed (all for reef, aquaforest mg+mineral salt recipes) i found myself having to dose mg with all for reef. it seems ok with the jim walsh recipe im using above, balance wise, i think it might be better. but every system differs anyway, for mag at least right?

Coralline does not deposit aragonite but rather a type of calcite that incorporates more magnesium. Thus any product needs to guess the relative demand from coralline vs other organisms for alk and calcium.9

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 14, 2024

GSnake said:
can you help me clarify something before i go ahead and mix up stuff.

is it fair to substitute the sulfate portion of your recipe, with the AF mineral salt but in a separate container ( so 68.7g of mineral salt in this instance )

on the other hand, AF wants me to dose equal amounts of reef mineral salt with the amount of calcium dosed. AF calcium is 50% weaker than your recipe, so its fair to use 2x reef mineral salt when mixing a solution. this way i can use what I already have made. The magnesium portion seems to be 6.91x weaker than yours, but im not sure how to account for this and the extra mag chloride ions. subbing the sulfate amount seems reasonable to me, it is very similar in composition right? is there something im missing

Not sure what you mean by 6.9-x weaker, but AF mineral salt is not offsetting any actual consumption of magnesium.

The best way to use Balling Part C or AF mineral salt is as a separate additive.

GSnake · May 14, 2024

i mean, aquaforest 100ml of mg solution in 100 L raises water by 1.2 ppm as stated on their website, and if I did the math right... 100ml of the mg solution I use in the 2 part recipe above in 100 L raises water by 8.3 ppm -- so relatively.

so this is 6.9x weaker than aquaforests regular mg and their recipe. (1.2 ppm vs 8.3)ppm)

yes i will be making AF mineral salt it as a separate additive

what would be the correct amount in grams to use of AF mineral salt for use with the 2 part recipe above though

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 15, 2024

If you are talking about af mineral salt, it is not designed to be a magnesium supplement and should never be used for that purpose. Yes, it has magnesium, but also lots of other stuff.

I’ve posted the af recipe a number of times. I’ll try to find it.

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 15, 2024

Here’s the recipe:

Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost

HI Randy, Two questions,1. (magnesium sulfate heptahydrate (3 cups) 1cups=?grams 2. I saw that the BRS formula is the same as yours But can I use AF REEF MINERAL SALT instead of Tropic Marin's Part C??? If applicable, how much solution do I need to use? I plan to mix with AF concentration...

www.reef2reef.com

GSnake · May 15, 2024

thanks for pointing the aquaforest material in the thread out, been a while since i read it.

any idea how much to adjust mag downwards by? (know the content % of AF mineral salt?) Im thinking to dilute the mag portion (of the cal/mg mix) by 50% as a starting point, or go even lower if you recommend. Ideally I want to keep the same strength in mag as your recipe, but unsure of mag amount in AF product.

ill also be making a 11:1 ratio mag cl: mag sulf solution on the side for adjustments

I am wondering about biopellet use and its effects on alkalinity. the increase of bacteria should make alk consumption go up, but this will skew the sodium ion % as well. is there a recommended compensation for biopellets and similar processes that consume alk? maybe 20% more AF mineral salt for balance etc

Randy Holmes-Farley · May 15, 2024

GSnake said:
thanks for pointing the aquaforest material in the thread out, been a while since i read it.

any idea how much to adjust mag downwards by? (know the content % of AF mineral salt?) Im thinking to dilute the mag portion (of the cal/mg mix) by 50% as a starting point, or go even lower if you recommend. Ideally I want to keep the same strength in mag as your recipe, but unsure of mag amount in AF product.

ill also be making a 11:1 ratio mag cl: mag sulf solution on the side for adjustments

I am wondering about biopellet use and its effects on alkalinity. the increase of bacteria should make alk consumption go up, but this will skew the sodium ion % as well. is there a recommended compensation for biopellets and similar processes that consume alk? maybe 20% more AF mineral salt for balance etc

Drop it to 1/3 of the specified amount.