Added a tang and now my tank is slowly crashing

[Slocke]

#fishmedic @Jay Hemdal @vetteguy53081

So I did what I said I never would and added a not QT'd tang and now I'm paying the ultimate price. Chocolate tang, A pyroferus, was the healthiest looking tang at my LFS. It was acting fully healthy for a few days then suddenly it was covered in a white sheen/tiny white dots one night. Moribound by next morning so I pulled it and euthanizeed ASAP.
All fish acted healthy for a week then christmas eve my pearlscale butterfly suddenly gets a white pale look and frayed fins. I move it to a copper QT 10 gallon but dead by morning. This morning my swallowtail angelfish is hiding in a cave and presumably dying.

All other fish look perfectly healthy at the moment. Sorry I don't have photos just this video.




So my plan is to go to petsmart and get the biggest tank they have and try and set up a big QT. I'll move over as much biomedia as I can but I have some questions.

1. Obviously what is this killing my fish?
2. The tank has a few corals, snails, and urchins. Would it make sense to treat the whole tank instead? I could pull all the corals and most of the inverts.
3. Should I fresh water dip?
4. How to combat ammonia?
5. All fish at once or is that too dangerous?
6. I use copper power, do I raise slowly or all at once and do I reduce salinity?
7. Some of my fish are copper sensitive. How do I treat them?

Fish:

• Banded snake eel 26"
• Gold spotted snake eel 25"
• Snowflake eel 15"
• Engineer gobies 10"
• Magnificent foxface 7"
• Pearscale butterfly 3"
• Regal angelfish 2.5"
• Zebra angelfish 4" (dying)
• Red coris wrasse 3"
• Melanarus wrasse 4"
• Dragon wrasse 3"
• Falco hawk 3"
• Maroon clownfish 3.5"
• Lunare wrasse 3"
• Lyretail hogfish 3"

 

[Ron Reefman]

15+ fish... how big is the tank?

 

[vetteguy53081]

#fishmedic @Jay Hemdal @vetteguy53081

So I did what I said I never would and added a not QT'd tang and now I'm paying the ultimate price. Chocolate tang, A pyroferus, was the healthiest looking tang at my LFS. It was acting fully healthy for a few days then suddenly it was covered in a white sheen/tiny white dots one night. Moribound by next morning so I pulled it and euthanizeed ASAP.
All fish acted healthy for a week then christmas eve my pearlscale butterfly suddenly gets a white pale look and frayed fins. I move it to a copper QT 10 gallon but dead by morning. This morning my swallowtail angelfish is hiding in a cave and presumably dying.

All other fish look perfectly healthy at the moment. Sorry I don't have photos just this video.




So my plan is to go to petsmart and get the biggest tank they have and try and set up a big QT. I'll move over as much biomedia as I can but I have some questions.

1. Obviously what is this killing my fish?
2. The tank has a few corals, snails, and urchins. Would it make sense to treat the whole tank instead? I could pull all the corals and most of the inverts.
3. Should I fresh water dip?
4. How to combat ammonia?
5. All fish at once or is that too dangerous?
6. I use copper power, do I raise slowly or all at once and do I reduce salinity?
7. Some of my fish are copper sensitive. How do I treat them?

Fish:

• Banded snake eel 26"
• Gold spotted snake eel 25"
• Snowflake eel 15"
• Engineer gobies 10"
• Magnificent foxface 7"
• Pearscale butterfly 3"
• Regal angelfish 2.5"
• Zebra angelfish 4" (dying)
• Red coris wrasse 3"
• Melanarus wrasse 4"
• Dragon wrasse 3"
• Falco hawk 3"
• Maroon clownfish 3.5"
• Lunare wrasse 3"
• Lyretail hogfish 3"

Video is short but the butterfly has lymphocysyis which is viral and somewhat a common issue with butterflies and large angels. The eyes on butterfly is cloudy and can stem from water quality or velvet. My two suspect causes is water quality from a high number of fish and bioload on the tank or velvet - reason for quarantining new specimens
If velvet, some signs you will see are fish scratching body against hard objects, lethargic behavior, Loss of appetite and weight loss, Rapid, labored breathing, Fins clamped against the body, and typically stay at the surface of the water, or remain in a position where a steady flow of water is present in the aquarium.

 

[Slocke]

Video is short but the butterfly has lymphocysyis which is viral and somewhat a common issue with butterflies and large angels. The eyes on butterfly is cloudy and can stem from water quality or velvet. My two suspect causes is water quality from a high number of fish and bioload on the tank or velvet - reason for quarantining new specimens
If velvet, some signs you will see are fish scratching body against hard objects, lethargic behavior, Loss of appetite and weight loss, Rapid, labored breathing, Fins clamped against the body, and typically stay at the surface of the water, or remain in a position where a steady flow of water is present in the aquarium.

I agree it appears like Lympho but I've had it for over a year and had no issues. The only change in months has been the tang (and a BTA).

I haven't seen any flashing. Fish seem to go from energetic to lethargic and then dead in a few hours. There seems to be mucous that covers them and tiny white dots just before they go downhill.

All corals are open and seem fine and though my nutruents are higher then I like they've been going down.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I agree it appears like Lympho but I've had it for over a year and had no issues. The only change in months has been the tang (and a BTA).

I haven't seen any flashing. Fish seem to go from energetic to lethargic and then dead in a few hours. There seems to be mucous that covers them and tiny white dots just before they go downhill.

All corals are open and seem fine and though my nutruents are higher then I like they've been going down.

The slime coat is likely separation and associated with water quality or stress. If you have any pics with the dots you mention, would help. The dots I wonder if could be stings from BTA as butterflies often attempt to take a bite out of them and tang may have brought in something such as velvet or flukes.
Some signs from flukes will be gills red or swollen with rapid breathing, fish acting lethargic or swimming near the water surface, hiding in the corner of tank or behind rocks, loss of appetite, shaking its head, flashing/darting, develop clamped fins, , or scratching against objects. They may also exhibit what looks like yawning from gill irritation develop, cloudy eyes and loss of color in which a couple of these signs apply to your fish

 

[Slocke]

The slime coat is likely separation and associated with water quality or stress. If you have any pics with the dots you mention, would help. The dots I wonder if could be stings from BTA as butterflies often attempt to take a bite out of them and tang may have brought in something such as velvet or flukes.
Some signs from flukes will be gills red or swollen with rapid breathing, fish acting lethargic or swimming near the water surface, hiding in the corner of tank or behind rocks, loss of appetite, shaking its head, flashing/darting, develop clamped fins, , or scratching against objects. They may also exhibit what looks like yawning from gill irritation develop, cloudy eyes and loss of color in which a couple of these signs apply to your fish

I think my regal has early signs. Cloudy eyes and maybe some dots. Also looks a bit discolored.


I’m going to do a big water change

 

[MnFish1]

I think the best course of action would be a hospital tank, copper treatment per protocol, followed by Prazipro. IF you can remove the coral, etc you could treat the display, but copper levels could be problematic. I'm sure it will be a major hassle to do this. Another option would be Ruby Rally Pro, which has some velvet, antibiotic and fluke activity. This is supposed to be safe for most invertebrates (though the directions recommend a hospital tank). Hope this helps and sorry for your issues

 

[Slocke]

Got the swallowtail to come out but it’s so hard to tell since it has that natural silver spots and in trying to catch it stirred up a lot of stuff

 

[Slocke]

I think the best course of action would be a hospital tank, copper treatment per protocol, followed by Prazipro. IF you can remove the coral, etc you could treat the display, but copper levels could be problematic. I'm sure it will be a major hassle to do this. Another option would be Ruby Rally Pro, which has some velvet, antibiotic and fluke activity. This is supposed to be safe for most invertebrates (though the directions recommend a hospital tank). Hope this helps and sorry for your issues

Thank you!
My plan right now is to prepare the biggest water change I can. Put the corals and snails in the waste water. Then slowly add copper to dt.

 

[MnFish1]

Thank you!
My plan right now is to prepare the biggest water change I can. Put the corals and snails in the waste water. Then slowly add copper to dt.

FYI - you do not need to 'add it slowly' - if you are using a product such as copper safe. In fact in the case of illness it's often better to add it per directions to get the level up as quickly as possible.

 

[Lavey29]

Thank you!
My plan right now is to prepare the biggest water change I can. Put the corals and snails in the waste water. Then slowly add copper to dt.

If you copper your DT then you won't have corals or inverts in there for a very very long time after.

 

[MnFish1]

If you copper your DT then you won't have corals or inverts in there for a very very long time after.

This is a good point!!, if you use copper in your display, you will need to use some mechanism to remove it after treatment.

 

[ninjamyst]

With the eels and large fish in a 125g tank, excellent water quality will be hard to maintain. I know you will say everything is fine prior to the tang but it is very possible the addition of the tang is the tipping point and poor water quality + stress of adding a large tang caused a breakout.

Good luck

 

[Slocke]

This is a good point!!, if you use copper in your display, you will need to use some mechanism to remove it after treatment.

If you copper your DT then you won't have corals or inverts in there for a very very long time after.

Thanks
It was never supposed to have corals. It’s just for my overgrown corals from my other tank. No snails will be annoying though

 

[Slocke]

With the eels and large fish in a 125g tank, excellent water quality will be hard to maintain. I know you will say everything is fine prior to the tang but it is very possible the addition of the tang is the tipping point and poor water quality + stress of adding a large tang caused a breakout.

Good luck

I didn’t increase feeding and a disease definitely killed the tang. I use a big skimmer and a massive refugium to control nutrients

 

[JayM]

I feel your pain. I lost about half my fish a couple of weeks ago with similar symptoms. I still don’t know precisely what I’m dealing with, but my remaining fish went into a hastily set up hospital tank with Coppersafe and have been doing well thus far.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I think my regal has early signs. Cloudy eyes and maybe some dots. Also looks a bit discolored.


I’m going to do a big water change

Regals can be sensitive to copper and I dont see parasite issue but you can QT to be safe. Make treatment level 2.0-2.25, This should all be done in a separate treatment tank with display fishless 6-8 weeks.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I agree it appears like Lympho but I've had it for over a year and had no issues. The only change in months has been the tang (and a BTA).

I haven't seen any flashing. Fish seem to go from energetic to lethargic and then dead in a few hours. There seems to be mucous that covers them and tiny white dots just before they go downhill.

All corals are open and seem fine and though my nutruents are higher then I like they've been going down.

That sure does look like lymphocystis on the butterfly, but in 50+ years, I’ve never seen that show up on a longterm captive. The rapid breathing looks more like velvet / Amyloodinium to me.

Jay

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I didn’t increase feeding and a disease definitely killed the tang. I use a big skimmer and a massive refugium to control nutrients

There is DEFINITELY a fish disease going on here. Water quality issues are not the root cause of this.

Are the eels all symptom free?

The issue is trying to determine which disease is in play: velvet shows rapid breathing, not eating, and death in a couple of days. Fish with ich will show white spots, normal breathing and will eat up until the end. Flukes cause cloudy eyes, rapid breathing, and the fish will eat right up to the end, and the time frame is weeks not days. The regal looks like flukes to me.

You may have more than one disease going on at once (ugh).

Jay

 

[Slocke]

There is DEFINITELY a fish disease going on here. Water quality issues are not the root cause of this.

Are the eels all symptom free?

Thanks!

At the moment the eels, wrasse, and the goby are all acting completely normal. Fed the eels today and they all ate well. It seems the flat bodied fish are showing symptoms. The swallowtail angel has come out and to eat since this morning but perhaps less enthusiastically then normal.

Would the eels handle copper power? I haven’t treated yet but am planning to early tomorrow.